SE13
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Post by SE13 on Dec 25, 2010 23:15:45 GMT
I'd linked Myfanwy with Betjeman and St Pancras, but I didn't think it held any substance..... But as others also seem to be suggesting St Pancras, I'll go along with it, though I can't think whereabouts the picture would have been taken, that window doesn't ring any bells. I still can't link this with the other clues *Before anyone laughs at me, I only post the normal quiz, I don't set it!*
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Dec 25, 2010 23:40:07 GMT
I still can't link this with the other clues I've got one more clue that I can give, that might provide a link between all the clues. You'll just have to wait a wee bit for me to polish off the finer parts of the teaser. You might find me or my kind inside sinkininny church, but you'll find a later champion outside. (There's also a clue in you'll......, if anyone is brave enough to get the specific location) There's still plenty of points on offer for working out the clues!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2010 1:07:54 GMT
sinkininny church is a name for St Enodoc's Church, Trebetherick in Cornwall where John Betjeman is buried (outside) so that links to St Pancras, not sure what the inside link is though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2010 1:36:50 GMT
Good suggestions, keep them coming in. One is warmer than the rest. I'm surprised no-one has had a really indepth look at the clues yet, but there is plenty of time to solve them before the usual quiz comes back. Something for the keen-eyed.... GoogleFollowing the Google link got me "The Eternal City" which is Rome,I believe....is this a clue leading us to the Roman Wall? It crosses the tube at a nummber of points but there's a big chunk of it by Tower Hill.... Saint Pancras (the Saint himself) seems to have a link to the Eternal city having lived there for a while.
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Rich32
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Post by Rich32 on Dec 26, 2010 2:08:18 GMT
Funnily enough St Pancras popped into my head early yesterday. But after trying (vainly) to crack M's cryptic clues to confirm my initial gut feeling, I thought I'd keep schtum.
Edit : to remove unnecessary quote.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2010 7:14:37 GMT
You might find me or my kind inside sinkininny church, but you'll find a later champion outside. A campanologist within the church and Fleur Lombard buried outside. The way the clues are heading is certainly pointing towards St Pauls.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2010 12:26:58 GMT
I've found some information about Widecombe-on-the-Moor and its parish church of St. Pancras - the 'Cathedral of the Moor'.
The information that's given about Saint Pancras is as follows:
Pancratius was born at Phrygia in around AD290. He was an orphan who, at the age of 14, was taken to Rome by his uncle, Dionysius, where he was converted to Christianity. Around AD304 he, along with three other men, were beheaded in the Via Aurelia for publicly declaring their faith; this was during the Diocletian persecution of the Christians.
This does give a clear link to 'The Eternal City'.
Information is also given that Saint Pancras is often invoked against headaches and cramp. This links back to earlier clues - with parsley being invoked as a cure for a certain kind of cramp.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2010 15:21:45 GMT
Perhaps I could add - prompted by a DVD of the BBC documentary that I have - that Sir John Betjeman's autobiography is entitled 'Summoned by Bells'. (There is also a second Sir John Betjeman BBC documentary - 'A Passion for Churches').
This could well provide the campanology link.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2010 10:22:51 GMT
For no particularly explicable reason, I am tempted to guess Blackfriars
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Dec 27, 2010 13:43:44 GMT
Hopefully by (much) later on this evening, my powers of concentration will be restored and I can tell all. Anyone care to have one final guess.... The exact location is still up for grabs.
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SE13
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Glorious Gooner
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Post by SE13 on Dec 27, 2010 14:05:12 GMT
Oh, not SP then.....
Hmmmmm, I can't crack the clues at all, so that's me stuck!
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Dec 27, 2010 16:20:21 GMT
exact, not general!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2010 16:46:21 GMT
I'd still plump for somewhere inside St. Pancras Station Chambers, before the current redevelopment work started. I think it to be the case that the (relatively) new paint on the wall up to a certain level indicates where the false ceiling would have been when the area was used by BR as offices. However, I can't be any more precise about where in the building the photo was taken!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2010 17:14:41 GMT
Still St Pancras for me, assume that the Iron Knight refers to Sir John Betjemans statue looking up at the ironwork of St Pancras, where the wolf comes into it i cannot even quess, as for exact location i will try the old Midland Railway ticket hall.
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SE13
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Post by SE13 on Dec 27, 2010 17:45:38 GMT
Well, if it is SP, it ain't down the bottom of Pancras Road, so it must be somewhere around the Euston Street entry, and I'd suggest somewhere in the upper area of the clock tower. SP is the only place I can fit in with anything I've deciphered, and the look of the window would probably fit the Euston Road underground entry area. One thing though is the cable run which sort of throws all that out.
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Oracle
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Post by Oracle on Dec 27, 2010 18:29:47 GMT
Is the reference to 'wolf' and 'city' something to do with Wolverhampton? Has Wolverhampton any connection with St Pancras?
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Post by phillw48 on Dec 27, 2010 18:56:15 GMT
It is the entrance hall to the Midland Hotel St. Pancras.
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SE13
In memoriam
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Glorious Gooner
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Post by SE13 on Dec 27, 2010 19:00:13 GMT
Is the reference to 'wolf' and 'city' something to do with Wolverhampton? Has Wolverhampton any connection with St Pancras? I did wonder that myself, but Wolverhampton is a City in it's own right, and not a suburb of another place. There's an unlikely link between there and Betjeman with the iron horse at the train station, and the fact that Betjeman wrote about knights, but that's seriously clutching at straws. Also trains from there would go to Euston I think, and although Euston is close to SP, I can't think of a link. Is there a statue of him at Wolverhampton? It's a station I've only been to with football, and police treat football fans like cattle, so you don't get a chance to look around.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2010 19:08:14 GMT
The windows flanking the grand staircase in St Pancars Chambers. See jpgmag.com/photos/92653. The wolf reference maybe to Romulas & Remus the founders of the eternal city of Rome and brought up by a wolf.
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Dec 27, 2010 19:10:23 GMT
I tell you what chaps/chapesses - I'll spill the beans and explain everything at 20.00 on 28/12. You've all got 25 hours to exercise your google-fu. Then I'll start awarding points! The exact location is still up for grabs.......... I'm off for a pint You've had all the clues, go and reread them.
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Post by phillw48 on Dec 27, 2010 19:44:28 GMT
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Dec 28, 2010 19:22:58 GMT
The answers will be delayed, due to a surprise visit from mr (and almost mrs) ducatisti - keep on exercising your brains!
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SE13
In memoriam
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Glorious Gooner
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Post by SE13 on Dec 28, 2010 20:10:34 GMT
Talk about teasing us!
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Post by phillw48 on Dec 29, 2010 10:32:59 GMT
I think mrfs42 must have lost the answers. ;D
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Dec 29, 2010 13:08:27 GMT
A little later than I intended, but here are the answers. The location is St. Pancras, just outside the loos for the 'Betjeman Arms' - I'm not quite sure exactly what that was prior to the redevelopment. A photograph looking the other way can be found here - it is the window directly behind the parasol. Clues (and exegesis therefrom)No headache for the Iron Knight from the wolf cityNo headache: St. Pancras was both beheaded and invoked against headaches. Iron Knight: well Iron Night really; St Pancras and 2 other saints are known as the 'Ice Saints' which has given rise to a belief in Sweden about the colder weather that can be ushered in by the three Ice Saints. The wolf city: Rome (also hinted at in the lmgify link of the 'Eternal City'). natura mirante, give me Petroselinum and I will cure crampsnatura mirante and Petroselinum are both in Latin, hinting again at Rome. natura mirante is from 'Gaudete', which was first published in a Finnish/Swedish book of liturgical songs (linking back to the Iron (K)nights). Petroselinum is the genus name for Parsley, which was formerly used to cure cramps and was given to statues of St. Pancras as a votive offering in the hope of curing cramp, there is also a vague hint in the capital 'P' pointing at St. Pancras. Point each to rincew1nd and slugabed for getting parsley and Rome, respectively. 2 points to stonesfan for getting 'Gaudete' and the old catholic liturgy hint. In the Surrey Twilight with Myfanwy and Mrs Wilberforce'in the Surrey twilight' appears in 'A Subalterns Love Song' written by John Betjeman, and 'Myfanwy' is also a poem written by him. Mrs Wilberforce: the land lady from 'The Ladykillers'. jazza point for correctly guessing Mrs Wilberforce. rhubarbrhubarb Overall Winner for correctly guessing St. Pancras, plus two extra points for connecting Mrs Wilberforce with St. Pancras and Saint Pancras. mtmikethom gets a point for getting the Betjeman reference. you might find me or my kind inside sinkininny church, but you'll find a later champion outsideme or my kind: Saints; nothing campanological in this instance - although some of you may know that I'm a bellringer (a District Secretary to boot!) and the delay this morning is due to me going off and helping at a ringing school! sinkininny church: or Sinking Neddy. Is indeed St Enodoc's church at Trebetherick where Betjeman (the later champion of St Pancras) is buried. Called sinking neddy because at one stage to only entry into the church for the annual service was through the roof as the church was buried in sand. The potential reference to Fleur Lombard was a herring rouge, I'm afraid. 2 points to mtmikethom for getting St Enodoc's church and Betjeman being buried outside and making the link between Saint Pancras and Rome. Points too to rhubarbrhubarb for mentioning the cramps, the parsley and the beheading. And the final point goes to lnwrelectric for working out that the wolf city was Rome because of Romulus and Remus. As to what it was before, I'm not utterly sure, I don't think it was the coffee lounge - but may well have been part of St. Pancras Chambers.
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slugabed
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Post by slugabed on Dec 29, 2010 13:42:08 GMT
Your answer has led me to look up a half-remembered saying from my time in Vienna... Pancrazius,Bonifazius und Die Kalte Sophie....once they are passed,summer has surely arrived... Happy New Year to you all.
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Dec 29, 2010 17:25:19 GMT
Oh yes, cold Sophia!
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Post by phillw48 on Dec 29, 2010 18:06:39 GMT
I was going by the colours that were on the lower part of the columns. The coffee lounge was at the eastern (KX) end of the hotel.
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Post by railtechnician on Dec 30, 2010 8:53:57 GMT
Ye Gods! Is mrfs42 Ted Rodgers in disguise and was this a hangover from 3-2-1?
Where's Dusty Bin? ;D
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