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Post by slidecage on Nov 28, 2010 23:22:44 GMT
A few questions:
1) An extension of London Overground from Crystal Palace to Clapham Junction is mentioned in the latest Modern Railways. Would this involve resignalling this section of the network, as otherwise where would the paths come from?
2) Modern Railways also mentions that a lot could be done with the Southern West London Line service. Apart from going to 8 car or going to 2tph, what else could be done?
3) Has it been considered to build a London Overground station in Deptford, near Abinger Grove? Platforms could then be built nearby on the Greenwich line, for interchange.
4) The TfL Rail and Underground Panel meeting papers in November talk about new platforms on the NLL and WLL to interchange with HS2 at Old Oak Common. Is it likely that the WLL platforms would be Overground only? The Southern service does not pass close to Old Oak?
Slidecage
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Post by norbitonflyer on Nov 29, 2010 19:17:50 GMT
1) An extension of London Overground from Crystal Palace to Clapham Junction is mentioned in the latest Modern Railways. Not heard of this before - is this separate from the ELLX2 extension to Clapham Junction via Peckham? Difficult to see who would use it, or what the terminal arrangments at CJ would be 3) Has it been considered to build a London Overground station in Deptford, near Abinger Grove? Platforms could then be built nearby on the Greenwich line, for interchange. Given the proximity of Deptford and New Cross stations, the availability of interchange with the DLR at Greenwich, and that from anywhere east of Charlton there is already access to New Cross via Lewisham, I can't see this being a priority. Is it likely that the WLL platforms (at Old Oak Conmmon) would be Overground only? The Southern service does not pass close to Old Oak? Yes is does, the routes diverge at Mitre Bridge Junction, immediately north of the bridge over the GWML. The plans for the HS2 station clearly show a WLL station south of the junction. |
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Post by fleetline on Nov 29, 2010 21:12:28 GMT
A few questions: 1) An extension of London Overground from Crystal Palace to Clapham Junction is mentioned in the latest Modern Railways. Would this involve resignalling this section of the network, as otherwise where would the paths come from? 2) Modern Railways also mentions that a lot could be done with the Southern West London Line service. Apart from going to 8 car or going to 2tph, what else could be done? 3) Has it been considered to build a London Overground station in Deptford, near Abinger Grove? Platforms could then be built nearby on the Greenwich line, for interchange. 4) The TfL Rail and Underground Panel meeting papers in November talk about new platforms on the NLL and WLL to interchange with HS2 at Old Oak Common. Is it likely that the WLL platforms would be Overground only? The Southern service does not pass close to Old Oak? Slidecage 1) The extension from Crystal Palace - Clapham Junction via Balham was announced in the summer. I **think** the idea to to replace some Southern services over this section. 2) I believe this is linked to increasing tph as paths on the BML are too limited to allow extra service, tho the re-extension to South Croydon in the next timetable (when they finally get the intrastructure introduced) will help the service get futher down the line. 3) Considering the fate of Surry Canal Road failure its unlikely any other new stations will be built any time soon. Interesting idea tho, isn't the SE lines on a viaduct at this point? Thinking of the issues at Brixton where putting platforms on two tracks is too expensive let along atleast 4 in this area (two ELL, 2 SE). 4) The idea is to make an interchange with platforms on both the WLL and NLL either ends of the station. Idea being all current services on both lines would stop there. |
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Post by bicbasher on Nov 30, 2010 0:56:46 GMT
I'm guessing the Crystal Palace extension would replace the 2tph Southern Outer South London Line service between Victoria and London Bridge which currently operates alongside the ELL between New Cross Gate and Crystal Palace.
If Thameslink services use the slow lines in addition to LO and Southern, the LO and TL would reduce the need for Southern paths into a reduced London Bridge after the works.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2010 9:20:57 GMT
If the Crystal Palace service extends to Clapham Jn it would be 4 tph at least. Then as there is no option for terminating platforms at Clapham Jn on the Brighton side this would be extended to Willesden Jn and thus seeing an end to the Southern's northern arm. The existing platform 2 and possibly a reinstated platform 1 at Clapham Jn would be busy enough with the South London service from the ELL.
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Post by andypurk on Nov 30, 2010 11:23:09 GMT
If the Crystal Palace service extends to Clapham Jn it would be 4 tph at least. Why would it be 4 tph? That would severly eat into capacity (due to short trains) on the routes into London. There is no reason why 2tph couldn't still terminate at Crystal Palace and 2 tph run through, off-peak at least. I agree that any LO service from Crystal Palace would use platforms 16 and 17 and run through to Willesden Junction, but they would take the paths of the current West London line service and actually free platform 2 up for the South London line trains. There is no reason why this would lead to the loss of the Southern service as well. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2010 12:33:02 GMT
So in essence West London Line will be a branch of East London Line? ;D Wait! Is that the mythical OrbiRail? Imagine the mammoth service of Stratford - (NLL) - Willesden Junction - (WLL) - Clapham Junction - (OSLL) - Crystal Palace - (ELL) - Highbury & Islington  EDIT: On more serious note - TfL website now shows completion of Clapham Junction branch of ELL as autumn 2012 (so not in time for Olympics). Is this new information? |
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Post by dazz285 on Nov 30, 2010 13:22:43 GMT
ELL will terminate at Clapham Junction possibly platform 2 ish as plans have not been released on how tfl intend to terminate Ell trains yet.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2010 16:17:06 GMT
Driver training has already started between Crystal Palace and Clapham Jct but this is for the ECS moves between NXG and Willesden depots. It is possible in the near future we could be driving passenger services through.
In regards to the Clapham Jct extension of the ELL, it may still be ready in time for the Olympics. The reason it is being published as Autumn 2012 is due to the fact that there has been a delay in awarding the contract to build the extension. The work was originally planned to start at the end of October but has been delayed until the beginning of 2011. I was informed by a senior manager that once the contract has been awarded, it will only take approximately 8 months to build so its possible it could be completed by this time next year. I guess TfL just want to safeguard themselves should any further delays occur.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2010 22:05:20 GMT
Is it possible that an ELL extension from Crystal Palace to Clapham Junction could link up with the South London Line extension, thus forming a loop and so reducing the need for terminal platforms at Clapham Junction? I don't have a track plan for the Clapham Junction area, so don't know what routings might be possible - or what conflicting movements such an arrangement might set up!
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Post by norbitonflyer on Dec 1, 2010 10:28:42 GMT
Is it possible that an ELL extension from Crystal Palace to Clapham Junction could link up with the South London Line extension, thus forming a loop ........... don't know what routings might be possible Certainly possible - I've travelled from platform 16 to Clapham High Street on an occasion when the SLL was diverted - resignalling at Victoria I think was the reason. |
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Post by andypurk on Dec 1, 2010 11:21:49 GMT
Is it possible that an ELL extension from Crystal Palace to Clapham Junction could link up with the South London Line extension, thus forming a loop ........... don't know what routings might be possible Certainly possible - I've travelled from platform 16 to Clapham High Street on an occasion when the SLL was diverted - resignalling at Victoria I think was the reason. Such a connection would only be possible by crossing to the fast lines somewhere (Balham or Clapham Junction) and accessing the connecting line at Pouparts Junction (which is only on the fast tracks). This is not a reasonable plan for a frequent all day service!! You can't access Factory Junction (and hence the South London Line) from platform 16 at Clapham Junction. Platforms 16 and 17 only go to/from the West London Line. |
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Post by andypurk on Dec 1, 2010 11:26:33 GMT
ELL will terminate at Clapham Junction possibly platform 2 ish as plans have not been released on how tfl intend to terminate Ell trains yet. The plans that I have seen somewhere show platform 2 being split in half, with a crossover in the middle to what is currently the siding. This will allow two trains (WLL and ELL/SLL) to independently use platform 2. I understand that this is due to the costs of refurbishing the trackbed in platform 1 (the trackbed is partially on a metal overhang which would need some expensive work). |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Dec 1, 2010 12:25:47 GMT
Certainly possible - I've travelled from platform 16 to Clapham High Street on an occasion when the SLL was diverted - resignalling at Victoria I think was the reason. You can't access Factory Junction (and hence the South London Line) from platform 16 at Clapham Junction. Platforms 16 and 17 only go to/from the West London Line. My memory must be playing tricks then - maybe we went from platform 12. |
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