AC into Euston??

I don't know what the official stance used to be/still is, but I believe DC drivers were once instructed to raise the pan when entering Euston, partly due to power supply issues with 4 car units. When the 378's first entered service on the DC, I remember that there were numerous failures which possibly resulted in the need for AC power.

Whether this is still the case, I do not know.

Martin

I would say that what metrolander saw were ECS moves to Euston for stabling. Silverlink and now LOROL stable quite a few units in Euston overnight on the west (Melton St) side. DC services always run on DC throughout, I don't think the DC lines start running under the wires until they start "burrowing under" to reach "The Wood" (platforms 9/10). Bit puzzled by the comment that he saw one leaving Euston on AC though. I think we need help and clarification from Daz and SomersetChris.

It might perhaps be AC mileage accumulation as presumably those units delivered to New Cross Gate from Ashford will have undertaken DC mileage only. I'm thinking particularly of 202 and 232-234, acknowledging that 202 has been working on the DC Lines but has it yet been out to play on the NLL/WLL? Furthermore, if 232/233 are still on the ELL and 234 has not returned from Derby, these will need 'proving' on AC in due course.

Units 201/225/226 were also running on the ELL for a while.
I didn't know 234 had gone back to Derby - there hasn't been much info on the 378s posted recently, so I'm not completely sure where some of the units are. It seems to be:

Willesden:
378003 - 007/009/012/013/015/017 - 024
378201/202/208/210/211/214/225 - 231

New Cross:
378135 - 154
378232/233

Derby:
378216/234 (and 4th cars for other units)

Not yet built:
378255 - 257

Is this correct?

It could have been ECS from Willesden TMD to Euston or if a passenger train, going via A Road (which looks like the up fast to you) which does not have a third rail.

I cannot say for certain, but would guess that it might have been going out via D Road (looks like the down fast to you).

A 313 could raise the pan on the move. But the difference on a 378 is that the reset button is not used with the raise pan button as it was on a 313

I have seen 313's runing down the WCML 25KV relief to Euston in the past and in Euston with their pans up. So why would it be any different now that 378's are running the service?

Xerces Fobe

E, and indeed, gad...

I was in the midst of composing a COLOSSALLY detailed reply to the flurry of reponses and slight questions raised, when I made a schoolboy error frankly too embarassing to describe, losing it all in the process... D'OH!

Now, it's too late so I may well come back to various things (I had myself been pondering many of the pantograph-related questions that have been asked purely as a result of my various observations) but a few quick (or not so quick, I can't help it) points;

As far as I could discern from my position there were 4 or 5 running lines visible, ALL the 378s I saw and most certainly those I paid particular attention to went in and out on the same lines - what I assume MUST be the up/down slow (2nd and 3rd from the left as I looked). My basis for this assumption was perhaps not clear from my OP but part of my confusion for the mixture of modes was that it was all over the same tracks; indeed, the main reason I didn't think I was seeing things in the bad light (having incorrectly assumed previously that trains ran on DC in normal service) was the sparking coming from either the wire or the rail at the same point going round the bend (up).

But definitely the same tracks! I paid particular attention to the 5 described before, can't remember the in/out order but up they went AC, AC, DC (insert bad heavy metal joke here) and down AC, DC (perhaps better placed here??)

The other tracks were up fast on the left (definitely - this was pretty much only Pendolinos which are LOUD round that bend and a Sleeper), and I had thought just the down fast to the far right but I was slightly confused to see a 350 heading toward Euston in that area; subsequent re-checking of the aerial view suggests there is another line here; It's hard enough to discern that layout even after familiarising yourself with the best information on Google but the main problem was I was stood at the other end of the bridge pretty much over the up fast so it was hard to make out all the details in the poor light! Further to the right of all of that were the buffer stop ends of whichever sidings those are.

Glenntandh; I'm clearly no expert but the aforementioned research driven by my curiosity on the area having singularly failed to work it out by eye one day (I didn't know the DC lines split underground, shame...) leads me to believe that the DC's merge into the slows pretty much directly before/after they dive under the tunnel entrances, so therefore they'd be under the wires pretty much to/from that point? Certainly, what I saw with my own eyes (as well as that Google earth recap) reaffirms this belief. As far as I gather from the same source (and as is perhaps the most obvious feature of this particularly labrynthine (sp?) area to observe from above), the up fast is on the far left at the point from which I was looking having flown over the whole slow/dc up and under faff between the tunnel mouths and the other side of the bridge; I guess perhaps a gradient to go along with the bend is why the noise inbound Pendolinos make suddenly becomes shocklingly evil at that particular point...

I wonder if the slight additional detail might help promote further chin-stroking on this subject. I also feel the need to re-visit and corroborate my findings, shame it's dusk by afternoon now!

CIAO

(sub-edited)

on leckie locos,if the pan went up with no wires,a devise called the ADD(auto dropping device)kicked in . this stopped the pan breaking its back by dropping the pan back down.it then had to be reset by a fitter getting on the roof (not under the wires) of course!

All trains with pans have this, loco or unit