A question about Shepherds Bush

I have just checked videos on YouTube again to confirm what I thought: at KO there are three lines now, with trains heading south usually running past the SB (Clapham direction) platform, and through trains the main NB one, with stopping trains using a NB loop. However, all three lines appear to be bi-directional with signals at the south end of the station, and points SB from the middle road to the SB. I am sure that in the past there was four-tracking at KO with two through roads, plus from the north two? into and out of the former Motorail bay platforms.

I have never been there but query if trains can run south on the NB at Shepherds Bush to avoid SB terminators waiting to be sent back?

Thanks everyone, makes a whole lot more sense now; should I have occasion to travel further south I will have a butchers for myself!

Mr Artery; yep, as I recall the feathers were indeed 2 o'clock/3 o'clock exactly as you describe.

Mr Oracle; I had been aware of the former Motorail terminal at Olympia, I wondered if that might had been something to do with it. As for running SB on NB, clearly (even to ignorant me!) there's a signal (and a big proper job, not a shunt signal) which appears to be for this purpose and was showing a red, so even though I don't know and didn't notice I presume there must be a crossover somewhere to the North. If I were to stab in the dark, I'd imagine at where the disused link to North Pole depot joins in? There's another apparently disused siding at around the same point on the other (east) side of the tracks, makes sense...?

Since I'm on on the West London Line, perhaps I'll cheekily slip another question in. Approaching Mitre Bridge junction northbound, is a signal with 3 feathers; diverging left, straight ahead, diverting right so sort of 10 / 12 / 2 o'clock. I know there's a left there; towards Willesden Junction, I know Southern trains go the other way towards the WCML, but what's the third route? Would be trains be routed here to head through Willesden SW towards Acton? I always imagined that divergence to be from the main part of the WCML rather than from the WLL itself. I wonder perhaps if it's anything to do with access to one of the depots/terminals etc in that area...

Edited to generally be more complete as a reply...

That's correct - I've never been entirely sure why the new southbound platform was built out from the old in the mid 1990s, covering the former southbound platform line, so that trains now stop on the former southbound through line with the northbound through line now being the bi-directional through line. The original southbound platform is still there I believe, rotting away trackless.

(I would have used 'up' and 'down', but haven't got a clue which is which on the WLL!)

Up is towards London, down is away. Hence travelling towards Watford Junction on the DC, for example, is down.

It does Dazz, thanks again everyone for the input, I might have a butchers at the national rail thing I'd been thinking to myself it was so much easier to find out about the equivalent information (if not officially) for LU lines. Generally on here!

Charlie J - I am aware of the general rule for 'up/down' (a terminology whose application I previously just could not fathom until looking it up) but perhaps Brian shared my confusion regarding the WLL as the line is of course, London - London hence no obvious answer! Thanks etr for the confirmation

Up/Down...
On the NLL
Richmond to Camden Road is Up
Stratford to Camden Road is Up
Camden Road to Stratford is Down
Camden Road to Richmond is Down...
There that will add confusion to the subject ;-)

Thanks for that - makes more sense now. So at the time that the line was resignalled and electrified the only passenger services were the peak hour shuttle from Olympia to Clapham Junction and the Intercity inter-regional services every hour or two. I guess there just wasn't the expectation that servies would develop into what they are today - or that selling the space on the east side of the station was thought to be worth it when balanced against the loss of operational land.

Confusion? Quite so! I always thought Richmond to Dalston was up and Dalston to Stratford was down, based on where the original North London Railway routes to/from Broad Street ran. I guess it's changed sometime since Broad Street closed in 1986?

AIUI the line from Dalston Junction to Broad Street was a later addition to the NLL, which originally was a feeder to the docks from the London and Birmingham Railway at Camden. This would make sense of the Up and Down useage outlined above by Dazz285. The NLL referred to the Broad Street extension as The Happy Afterthought, as it was so successful.

Just a detail point:
I'm not sure when the re-signalling/track simplification took place,sometime in the 80s,I think,but I believe electrification came a bit later.But at the time of electrification,the WLL definitely had a "proper" service.
The initial WLL service from Clapham Jct. to Willesden Jct. was provided by 2-car 1st generation DMUs (Annie and Clarabelle) until about the mid 90s,I'm sure on this as a friend of mine lived backing on to the track at that time.
When Eurostar started,the third-rail got as far as North Pole,and I suppose the OHLE was extended South from Mitre Bridge to meet it at some point,probably when the NLL got its OHLE,and enabling a full electric service.
That's not to detract from the point that the simplification works at Olympia were short-sighted and will probably,if possible,have to be reversed at some point to restore operational flexibility....
What IS the minimum acceptable width for a platform in passenger use?

They are all there, but can take some finding (the 'New Lines' are MD120 in LNW_S, the NLL/Goblin EA 1310/20/70 in Anglia). But they do pre-date the ELLX...

A few points arising from this discussion.

In 1988 the NLL east of Canonbury West Junction was transferred from the London Midland Region to the LT&S Area of Anglia Region and Dalston Western Junction box was staffed by LT&S relief signalmen when required. At the same time the change of up/down designation of running lines was moved to Canonbury West Junction. By 1992 management and staffing of Dalston box had passed back to "Network North" at Watford and if Camden Road was not restored as the up/down changeover at that time it was when the whole NLL went into the East Anglia Zone of Railtrack in 1994.

The exceptions to the convention of mileposts always being on the down side were the Great Western and the Midland. The T&H Line is 'up' from Woodgrange Park Junction to London St. Pancras via Junction Road Junction and Engine Shed Junction and the mileposts are on the up side. Except that in the last couple of years Network Rail maintenance staff obviously steeped 'Eastern" history have replaced some missing mileposts on the DOWN side!

If a LU tube driver wished to drive London Overground trains, he would be required to go through exactly the same training as a totally new recruit. There is no direct transfer between LU and any NR company. London Overground has been operated by London Overground Rail Operations since 2007 as part of the National Rail network, under the franchise control and branding of Transport for London

etr, thanks again; your learned wisdom has prompted me to be less impetuous, and more studious in my searching! I'm still trying to work out if WLL is Anglia or Southern, I'm going to search Anglia again but what I'm sure I'm not mistaken of is that no 'Southen' document exists on that site? Or might the WLL be 'Wessex'?? (I'm thinking, Clapham...)