cso
Posts: 1,043
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Today
Aug 23, 2010 18:41:32 GMT
Post by cso on Aug 23, 2010 18:41:32 GMT
What went wrong today? Seemed to me that the Met line was in disarray almost all day today...
One of the comments from my friends was along the lines of "Since TFL can't seem to run the normal trains to time, why are they trying out the new train ATM?" as he passed it squashed like a sardine from Baker Street to Watford!
Although it was the quietest evening Uxbridge service I've been on ;D
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Today
Aug 23, 2010 18:48:00 GMT
Post by harlesden on Aug 23, 2010 18:48:00 GMT
Had my first trip on the Met today in months - Kings Cross-Wembley Park. Platform indicators at Finchley Road and Wembley Park indicated no delay or long gaps in service. 12:30PM
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Colin
Advisor
My preserved fire engine!
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Today
Aug 23, 2010 18:50:38 GMT
Post by Colin on Aug 23, 2010 18:50:38 GMT
A visit to the TfL website reveals "an earlier signal failure at Baker Street".
So you could have answered your own question had you looked at the said website.
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Today
Aug 23, 2010 19:12:36 GMT
Post by citysig on Aug 23, 2010 19:12:36 GMT
One of the comments from my friends was along the lines of "Since TFL can't seem to run the normal trains to time, why are they trying out the new train ATM?" as he passed it squashed like a sardine from Baker Street to Watford! Now why didn't we think like that . Given your friend appears to be such an expert on railway operations, we'll no doubt seek further advice from them. Not. The new trains, along with the new signalling, will one day hopefully prove to be more reliable than the older kit. We can't get them in unless we test them. Frustrating though it is to have days where delays mount up, we don't have days like today everyday. At least with the S-stock there will be a bit more room, so the sardine effect will be a little less likely.
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Deleted
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Today
Aug 23, 2010 20:39:56 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2010 20:39:56 GMT
I was on a Southbound Amersham - Aldgate train which tipped out at Wembley Park this morning. Rather annoying because I had my bike with me meaning I had to squash into a Baker Street train in order to make it to victoria (cycling from Baker Street) on time for my train to Brighton!
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cso
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Today
Aug 23, 2010 22:06:47 GMT
Post by cso on Aug 23, 2010 22:06:47 GMT
A visit to the T fL website reveals "an earlier signal failure at Baker Street". So you could have answered your own question had you looked at the said website. Well, yes... but then the announcement at wembley park was about emergency engineering works on the 'baker street junction' which doesn't imply to me a Signal Failure... so I was wondering if anyone had any more information. Obviously looking for that is frowned upon though
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cso
Posts: 1,043
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Today
Aug 23, 2010 22:11:16 GMT
Post by cso on Aug 23, 2010 22:11:16 GMT
Now why didn't we think like that . We can't get them in unless we test them. Not meaning to have a dig at you personally, here... Quite... why don't people think like customers? I agree, that you need to test the new trains. However, instead of running the testing trains while there's a suspension and severe delays, would it not be more beneficial to the customers in the 'here and now' to run passenger service trains? Certainly, I would have thought the passengers of today would prefer that rather than seeing this shiny, new, empty train wandering around the tracks.
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Colin
Advisor
My preserved fire engine!
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 0:15:02 GMT
Post by Colin on Aug 24, 2010 0:15:02 GMT
Well, yes... but then the announcement at wembley park was about emergency engineering works on the 'baker street junction' which doesn't imply to me a Signal Failure... On it's own emergency engineering works certainly doesn't mean a lot, but given that there was a signal failure in the same area, putting two & two together would almost certainly equal four. You never mentioned emergency engineering work in your OP though. so I was wondering if anyone had any more information. Obviously looking for that is frowned upon though But again, you never asked for more information in your OP - you simply asked "what went wrong today?" We don't generally frown upon anyone enquiring about the background to such things, but you only asked a rather broad question and didn't say you already knew at least part of what had occurred. Had you asked a different question, with a little more information added, I'm quite sure you'd see a more appropriate response.
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 8:12:03 GMT
Post by citysig on Aug 24, 2010 8:12:03 GMT
I agree, that you need to test the new trains. However, instead of running the testing trains while there's a suspension and severe delays, would it not be more beneficial to the customers in the 'here and now' to run passenger service trains? Certainly, I would have thought the passengers of today would prefer that rather than seeing this shiny, new, empty train wandering around the tracks. In a perfect / fantasy world, the new trains would have been delivered ready for service, and our drivers would simply need to jump into the cab and off they go. But it cannot be done like that unfortunately. Staff need training, the trains need rigorous testing, so that when they all enter service there will be far fewer teething problems than there could be. The testing program has to stay on track to get the trains in sooner rather than later. The odd passenger trip has been done, but the testing program does mean that sometimes it won't be in service. We cannot yet use the stock to substitute another train - they are not technically "ours" to use. The testing simply cannot be restricted to overnight running or to times when nothing else is going on - unless people don't want the trains in service until 2015. We do have a say in whether the stock operates its test runs, but do have to have a fairly good reason to cancel them. Whilst the train you saw was a bit like rubbing salt in the wound, it may have been that even this train was en-route to depot to get it out of the way of the service disruption.
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Chris M
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 8:16:50 GMT
Post by Chris M on Aug 24, 2010 8:16:50 GMT
Do you (service control) have any say in whether a particular run will run in passenger service or not (even if only as a request)?
How much notice do you get about whether a given test path (which I guess will be runs as required?) will be in passenger service or not?
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Deleted
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 14:05:47 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 14:05:47 GMT
Do you (service control) have any say in whether a particular run will run in passenger service or not (even if only as a request)? How much notice do you get about whether a given test path (which I guess will be runs as required?) will be in passenger service or not? We do have a timetable for the required runs. Some are in passenger service, the odd one is empty and at least one of the empty trips can run in passenger service if the Service Manager allows it (the I/Op on the train has to contact the SM prior to the train leaving the depot).
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 14:15:47 GMT
Post by astock5000 on Aug 24, 2010 14:15:47 GMT
Yesterday afternoon (probably about 16:15) I got on an Uxbridge train at Baker Street. Between Baker Street and Finchley Road, I saw two trains pass out of service. The first one had 'Wembley Park' on its destination blind, and was too far south to be reversing at Swiss Cottage. Why were these trains running empty? The testing simply cannot be restricted to overnight running or to times when nothing else is going on - unless people don't want the trains in service until 2015. Maybe LU should have asked the passengers about that. I'm sure some of them wouldn't mind waiting another 5 years...
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Deleted
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 19:25:33 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 19:25:33 GMT
That would probably have been the "FIFA Delegate Special" heading towards Baker Street. I hope they bought tickets ;D ;D
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 19:32:58 GMT
Post by deadmans on Aug 24, 2010 19:32:58 GMT
One of the comments from my friends was along the lines of "Since TFL can't seem to run the normal trains to time, why are they trying out the new train ATM?" as he passed it squashed like a sardine from Baker Street to Watford! At least with the S-stock there will be a bit more room, so the sardine effect will be a little less likely. WONDERFUL More people STANDING like sardines. Lets make it clear we will soon have LESS SEATS NOT MORE.
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Deleted
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Today
Aug 24, 2010 19:55:19 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 19:55:19 GMT
Yes, fewer seats. I can only compare to Southern & Southeastern's 377 Class services. They tend to be longer distance than those on The Met. Both operators have used 3+2 and 2+2 formations. Eventually 2+2 sems to have been favoured. In my experience the average posterior let alone should width does not allow for comfortably travel with 3+2 arrangements.
Now I am sure the argument will be spread that LU is not a a franchise like either Southeastern or Southern and so should not be compared as such. I am simply not comparing the service, only the size of people. Unless you presume to suggest that people in North London have slimmer waist lines or similar than those south of the river... And I am open to any stats you may have to offer.
While I know some longitudinal seating may not be ideal for everyone, but neither was the abolition of smoking carriages or space for wheelchairs, luggage and buggies. But that is progress or should I suggest a more inclusive arrangement.
Two last points - most people in central London sit at desks all day. What is so bad about having to stand for a short while? There were always going to be fewer seats owing to wider doors and space for wheelchairs. While my personal preference would have been for 2+2 seating with some folding seats in a longitudinal arrangment, there still would have been significantly less seating capacity than on the A Stock.
Sorry, have verged very much off topic!
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Today
Aug 25, 2010 10:58:48 GMT
Post by londonstuff on Aug 25, 2010 10:58:48 GMT
At least with the S-stock there will be a bit more room, so the sardine effect will be a little less likely. WONDERFUL More people STANDING like sardines. Lets make it clear we will soon have LESS SEATS NOT MORE. Here comes Deadman's negativity again Maybe I travel in a different rush hour to you but I can count on my fingers the number of times I've got a seat on certain journeys in the last few years. In that respect, I welcome more standing room. Maybe ask the people at Mile End who have to wait for several trains to go by before even being able to board what they'd prefer - I'd imagine you'd get the same response. Passenger numbers are only going to increase. Short of installing a complete new signalling system, which is, no doubt, probably not far off a decade at the earliest at being in place, I'd chose the lesser of two evils and actually prefer to get on a train and stand. During the rush hour at least, a seat is just a bonus. It shouldn't really be like that, but this is the real world we live in. Try and look at the glass being half full rather than half empty and the reason why we're here is that we have an appreciation of LU and not trying to put it down all of the time.
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Deleted
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Today
Aug 25, 2010 12:46:19 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2010 12:46:19 GMT
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Today
Aug 26, 2010 9:08:42 GMT
Post by citysig on Aug 26, 2010 9:08:42 GMT
WONDERFUL More people STANDING like sardines. Lets make it clear we will soon have LESS SEATS NOT MORE. Here comes Deadman's negativity again Funnily enough the post I made a couple of minutes ago in the S-stock thread was following on from more of his apparent willingness to comment against his employers future. Maybe they will cut him out of it and allow us willing to welcome the new stock to continue. The S-stock has less seats. But, connected to the new signalling and higher reliability, there will be more trains. More trains with less seats or less trains with just a few more seats? You decide.
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Today
Aug 26, 2010 11:22:27 GMT
Post by pakenhamtrain on Aug 26, 2010 11:22:27 GMT
Don't laugh but on some of our V/Line services people are bringing folding chairs on board because the train is full.
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Ben
fotopic... whats that?
Posts: 4,282
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Today
Aug 26, 2010 15:47:52 GMT
Post by Ben on Aug 26, 2010 15:47:52 GMT
Depends if its addiction or not. Then a 'want' becomes a 'need'...
Will be good when the pax 'S' comes out to play again.
Thing is do you invest in the signalling side first or the trains first? Opting for the trains gives out a better image, opting for the signaling causes massive disruption and no tangeble benefits till the new trains are there. It does however negate the need for any reduction in seating capacity, but will need closures regardless when it happens. Signalling seems to be the better optin to go first, but trains first is far far better for PR and image. And allows better flexibility if the signalling is then delayed by 'x' years...
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