Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2010 21:29:29 GMT
I have heard numerous accounts of 1938 tube stock being split at Watford Junction after the morning peak and this was common practice until @ 1962. My understanding is that 3 cars of a 7 car train, including an UNDM were left at Watford Junction and 4-car unit of 1938 stock plus a standard trailer being used for the off peak service on the Bakerloo; the sets were re-coupled for the evening peak.
I have also have had unsubstantiated accounts of 3 car 1938 tube sets, lead by an UMDM travelling from Watford Junction to Croxley Depot for a short period, until a stop was put on this practice due to safety concerns. Can anyone confirm if these workings did actually occur or this nothing more than just a bit of fanciful folklore?
Xerces Fobe
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metman
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Post by metman on May 26, 2010 21:42:32 GMT
They did occur! The 1927 trailer was generally in the 3 car unit, but 4 1927 trailers were in 4 car sets too. Because 58 1927 standard stock trailers were converted they became known as the 58 trailers, but obviously did not date from 1958!
The unions were most unhappy with the working arrangements as you say. In the 'old' days the shunter only had the R door to look from (there were no car end windows like there are now!) and in the rain it was rightfully felt harsh to be able to expect the shunter to do a couple of miles in the UNDM!
In the end, 15 UNDMs were swapped with 15 DM from the Piccadilly line, where the uncoupling was less complex!
Hope this helps
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2010 21:46:32 GMT
I have also have had unsubstantiated accounts of 3 car 1938 tube sets, lead by an UMDM travelling from Watford Junction to Croxley Depot for a short period, until a stop was put on this practice due to safety concerns. Can anyone confirm if these workings did actually occur or this nothing more than just a bit of fanciful folk law? Xerces Fobe It's recounted by J Graeme Bruce in his Tube train book (under 1949 Stock - together with subsequent stock rearrangements), in terms that it did happen before the difficulties became obvious, and arrangements were changed. |
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on May 26, 2010 21:57:52 GMT
I have heard numerous accounts of 1938 tube stock being split at Watford Junction after the morning peak and this was common practice until @ 1962. My understanding is that 3 cars of a 7 car train, including an UNDM were left at Watford Junction and 4-car unit of 1938 stock plus a standard trailer being used for the off peak service on the Bakerloo; the sets were re-coupled for the evening peak. Yes, that's very true. I've got the Bakerloo Duty Scheduler's copy of the WTT (32, 5/6/50) that brought uncoupling back in my library, complete with lots of biro corrections and amendments - centred around Watford platforms 5 and 6, funnily enough. I'm also moving this thread to Historical. (now done) When I get chance I'll have a look at exactly what went on - the proof of the folklore might be paid off by a close examination of the amendments. |
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Phil
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Post by Phil on May 26, 2010 22:08:50 GMT
And isn't that the reason stock on the Bakerloo was 'wrong way round' - to allow that precise movement at the north end of the line to take place?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2010 22:17:40 GMT
Thanks all for your prompt responses I am just just finishing off my second set of 1938 stock for my Croxley Wiggenhall Road Depot layout and have put a power bogie in the UNDM so that I can re-create this type of working.
Xerces Fobe
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on May 26, 2010 22:27:33 GMT
<returns from library> Hmmm. Interesting, the further proof of the folklore might or might not be borne out by the following data. I'd also misremembered the alterations, they were all at Stanmore, and not Watford. After a bit of jiggery-pokery - here is the Sunday rolling stock workings:  If I can photograph and twiddle the other bits, I'll post them up. |
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Post by t697 on May 26, 2010 22:38:04 GMT
And isn't that the reason stock on the Bakerloo was 'wrong way round' - to allow that precise movement at the north end of the line to take place? Hopefully only a little off the thread, the current 1972TS are also 'wrong way round' for a related reason. The UNDM cars have recycled controls from the 1938/49 UNDM's. The brake control isn't very fine. So with them all wrong way round with the 3 car at the North end any 'reform' in Stonebridge Park can be done by moving the (south) 4 car unit which has full driving controls both ends and so misjudged braking accidents when coupling are virtually eliminated. |
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