Steam through Buckhurst Hill

Phew! This took some research on my part whilst MM was replying! The only locos that I know of, and this is under correction, that could have been the last steam locos used through Buckhurst Hill were the few Class J15 locos, based at Stratford. These post-dated that Epping-Ongar steam shuttle. The last J15s were actually withdrawn on 16th September 1962.

From a 2006 thread I have found that I posted this:

The photo published on this forum of 2 x J15s on an excursion begs the question as to whether they had tripcocks? Well, I should have known better! I learned to drive on the North Norfolk Railway, and of course they have the surviving J15. This is the info about it:


65462 was allocated to Norwich Thorpe in June 1960 and then moved to Stratford in January 1961, still carrying its 32C shed plate! Later in the year it had air-brake trip-cock equipment fitted on the right-hand loco rail-iron and under the left hand tender frames for use on the Leyton to Epping/Ongar line. The former GER branch was by then part of London Transport's Central Line, but BR J15s hauled occasional specials and freight trains on it until April 1962.

After that I assume it was all-Diesel, namely BTH Class 15?

How's that: as someone said yesterday I am a mind of information but in truth I have to research and that's my forte. I have written and stored millions of words of researched text but it takes time & effort to retrieve it!

Perhaps the retrieval King can find the photos of the 2 x J15s?

Another good deed done! It is a very interesting subject and one that I have been interested in for 40 years +!

I for one would be fascinated! From PSUL, 1963, these (diesel) passenger workings ran:

Temple Mills East - Leyton (L.T.B.) (30ch.)
6-20 a.m. SUN Liverpool St.—Epping
6-56 a.m. SUN Liverpool St.—Epping
N 2-26 a.m. Stratford—Epping
3-51 a.m. Stratford—Epping
N 3-11 a.m. Epping—Stratford
N 4-37 a.m. Epping—Stratford
5-06 a.m. SUN Epping— Stratford
5-36 a.m. SUN Epping—Statford

Where 'N' = not advertised to the public.

The timings from 1963 I think applied pretty well for the next decade. It would be interesting to see the TTs.

As to the connection with BR, originally this was at LNER Loughton Branch Junction, then at some stage Loughton Branch Junction/Loughton Junction on the Lea Valley line. However in 1963 it quotes Temple Mills East. I have a feeling in my mind that at some stage the connection was moved to Temple Mills Yard, as it was mainly a goods line. Does this make sense please?

There are some good photos in "branch line to Ongar" by Jim Connor. I think the main line connection at Leyton lasted until May 1968

Staff trains - still timetables and visible in the WTT, but not the PTT. Or goods paths that could carry staff in the brake van.

Not forgotten about the steam times, I'm just working out the best way of displaying them.

I'm sure that the Leyton BR connection lasted longer than that. In fact I can remember going over the points as the train ran down into the cutting/tunnel when I was at Junior School (I asked a teacher there about it at the time) so that would have been around 1972 at the earliest I reckon.

Cheers

Richard

Wasn't the crossover just downhill of the BR connection left in place for a while after that, too?

The October 1968 Underground Guide lists BR services between Epping and Liverpool St only available to season tix holders.

In 1953 just after the rear- end collision in the eastbound tunnel between stratford and leyton,I was returning to my national service base at R A F Chigwell (station -Buckhurst Hill) on the 3.15 am approx, from Stratford Lea valley platform to Epping . As we approched Leyton junc: we were halted alongside the ramp cutting up from the tube tunnels and looking over from my train , saw that a J69 was well down the eastbound ramp dragging out damaged tube stock from the tunnel mouth attatched to it by a chain.(I think it was part of the rear collision train). This procession proceeded into Leyton EB platform, and then was pushed back towards us on the non electric line we were standing on and then into the small siding fromthere which adjoined Temple mills yard. Unfortunateley I didn't have a camera at the time, I wonder if anyone else witnessed or knows anything about this occurence ? It took about 3/4 of an hour to complete,delaying the 3.15 accordingly.

The majority of the J69s were built as suburban passenger locos (the others were for shunting), with the GER's standard Westinghouse air brakes - they were a mainstay of the GE suburban workings (and as such I imagine would have been a frequent sight at Buckhurst Hill).

According to the relevant RCTS loco history, about ten were fitted with tripcocks, and retained their condensing equipment when the others lost it, in about 1930 for use on transfer freights to the Southern via the East London line.

I assume the reason for the initial standard fitment of condensing equipment was the tunnels outside Liverpool Street (can anybody confirm?)

Although the GER had experimented in about 1920 with a form of trip cock signalling, subsequently the only LNER locos with trip cocks would have been those required to work over Underground lines (I think excluding the former GC & Met joint lines north of Harrow). For the GE section, apart from the J69s for the ELL and J15s for goods working on the Central extension, this also affected the F5s for the Ongar shuttle service.

I suspect in pre-LT days goods to Leyton, etc would have been worked any handy J15 or similar, the change would have been to restrict the duties to the small pool with trip cocks.