metman
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Post by metman on Feb 28, 2008 16:12:10 GMT
I have been reading about the 1956 stock recently. I remember travelling on it as a child-it was on the Northern Line by then. However, as an 8 year old I wasn't really clued up on my rolling stock. I never knew if the 56 stock could be coupled to the 59 stock or did it have to be kept separate?
I also read that the outer ends of the 56 stock only had mechanical couplers which looked similar to the 73 single ended couplings. Uncoupling was utilised on the Picc (no Heathrow then!) but when the trains were transfered to the Northern, were the couplers changed because of the Kennington loop, or did depot crews just have to be careful?
The 56ts was scrapped when spare 62s came over from the Central Line in 1995?
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Post by ruislip on Feb 28, 2008 21:08:55 GMT
The way the seats were arranged reminded me more of 38s than 59s or 62s--even though I remember riding on Piccies composed of a 59 unit and a 56 unit. Also the exterior appearance resembled part 38 and part 59 stock.
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Oracle
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Post by Oracle on Feb 28, 2008 21:27:05 GMT
The three 1956 Stock trains differed in the cab end (roof) treatments, though they all had the 1938 Stock destination lights I think. Inside they had more wood around the door vestibules than 1959 Stock. A nice compromise between the Gentlemen's Club 1938 Stock and the Workingmen's Club 1959 Stock I thought.
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metman
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Post by metman on Feb 29, 2008 0:59:01 GMT
Ok, so it sounds like the 56 and 59 could work together. I heard the seats were a little more generous than the 59/62 stock!
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towerman
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Post by towerman on Feb 29, 2008 2:59:15 GMT
When built 56TS had mechanical couplers only(leading ends) but were modified after the arrival of 59TS.
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metman
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Post by metman on Feb 29, 2008 10:17:58 GMT
Fantastic, thanks, that's just what I wanted to know!
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prjb
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Post by prjb on Feb 29, 2008 18:25:45 GMT
The 56ts had there 'cross' marker lights removed and a standard 59ts layout applied in the early 90's. This was around the time the 59's received a final overhaul which included the installation of Passenger Emergency Alarms and a Public Address system. The work was carried out at Highgate which was re-opened specifically to do that upgrade. The 56's and 59's were definitely compatible because I remember working them as both a guard and a driver.
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metman
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Post by metman on Feb 29, 2008 18:42:07 GMT
The marker lights were upgraded to headlights in this overhaul to I believe?
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Mar 14, 2008 17:14:17 GMT
Uncoupling was utilised on the Picc (no Heathrow then!) **Warning Timetable Esoterica** If you're interested, the 1956 stock first appears in District and Piccadilly WTT 78 - 9/6/58 (previous one 77: 28/7/57 has no mention of them), with one unit at Cockfosters, and two at Northfields. The 3 trains 197, 198, 199 worked as follows: Mondays - Fridays: 197 off Cockfosters 5.22, uncouples at Northfields 9.16 1/ 2on the Local road, unit (3) forms train 297 - at Northfields Depot 9.26 - 10.11., 197/297 recouple at Cockf 3.33, stables at Nflds 8.37pm. 198 off Nflds 4.26, uncouple Cockf Depot 9.54, 198 (4) enters again at Oakwood 10.4 1/ 2; 298 (3) enters service again 10.44 1/ 2, also via Oakwood. 198/298 recouple at Northfields 4.22 1/ 2 on the Fast, heading East, uncoupling again at Cockf at 8.1 1/ 2, forming 198/298 again stabling 10.40 and 10.44pm respectively. 199 enters service at Nflds 7.32am, doesn't uncouple at all, stables Nflds 7.28pm. All three trains in service on Saturdays, but no uncoupling at all on the Picc. Sundays 297 (3) enters service 5.32am Nflds, 197 (4) also at Nflds starts 7.13am, 197/297 couple 2.37pm at Northfields (Local line EB), stabling as 197 Cockf 11.13pm. 298 6.58am/198 8.31 off Nflds, couple Nflds 2.17 (also Local line EB), stable as 198 12.54am Nflds. 299 8.54am/199 9.24am off Cockf, couple 2.25 1/ 2, at Cockf, stables at 11.53pm at Nflds. Pattern repeats (with only detail varaitions) in WTTs 79 (1/12/58), 80 (2/3/59), not got an 81, 82 (21/3/60); but by WTT 83 (10/10/60) there was no specific mention of the 1956 stock in the District and Picc TTs. |
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Post by ruislip on Mar 14, 2008 18:03:16 GMT
Did the District and Piccadilly have a combined WTT in those days? I can see a reason for doing so would be that both lines worked the Hounslow branch. Also, did those three 1956 stocks concentrate solely on the Hounslow branch, or did they make any trips towards Uxbridge/Rayners Lane/South Harrow?
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Mar 14, 2008 18:17:48 GMT
The earliest combined District and Piccadilly that I can definitively state to exist is the Metropolitan District Railway of 4/6/32 (No. 107) when the Picc. extended to South Harrow.
I've then got a gap in my collection of about 6 years, and then there is a combined District and Piccadilly No. 15 which is Sundays only and that came out on 8th May 1938.
I'd suggest that the District and Picc were combined at the time of the formation of the LPTB in 1933.
The highest number District and Picc combined TT I've got (and therefore know of) is No 93 which started on 14th October 1968 - after that there is another gap in the collection for the separates - the nearest modern Picc (rather than London Electric Railway Picc) I've got is No 3 from September 1974 (Saturdays only); however I suspect that the District is still perpetuating the series started with the LPTB as the nearest separate District I've got of that date is 95 which dates from 5/10/1970. I just need to find either a copy of Piccadilly 1 & 2 or District 94 to answer when the timetables separated again. I have a sneaking suspicion that the Picc might have run for a while on Timetable Notices between 1970 - 72, but I've only got a feeling on this - I've never seen a combined District and Piccadilly timetable notice *apart* for the 1935 Coronation - which covers all lines in detail apart from the Met; however the 1953 coronation was a separate notice for each line. During the period of the combined Working Timetables (main) I've got lots of Timetable Notices (covering Easter and Christmas) for both lines but always separate, apart from this Coronation notice.
The workings are shared equally (at a quick glance) when running as 7 cars between the branches of the Picc - he says searching for N7 N3 N4 amongst all the Q8, R8, R6 &c......
After uncoupling they seemed to do a shortie to Acton and then out to Hounslow, Hounslow - Arnos - Uxbridge certainly in the 1958 WTT. Whatever the 3-car and 4-car bits of the same train did, they worked together towards the coupling point - at Cockfosters there could be anything up to 20 minutes between both bits of the same train arriving, though at Northfields they were within a minute or a minute-and-a-half of arriving - and of course they had to be on the same line and travelling in the same direction! ;D
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