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Post by edb on Feb 9, 2007 8:28:12 GMT
Thing is, Ken keeps saying that the fare increases are to pay for improvements. All I have seen is new buses and stations being wrecked in so called 'upgrade' works, admittedly, the shambles that was once Chalk Farm, has now been sorted, but still looks a mess, where the half-job has been patched up. Are there any good examples of refurbishment? From a station prespective, the trouble is the station remains open during the work. So you get used to the 'new' bits before you see the whole picture. It also takes soooooooo long for work to be completed. It's a nightmare working at a station being refurb'd Why don't they close more of them surely H&S have a fun job at the Stations being refurbished? It is interesting that so much money is spent on the refurbs but some of the obvious stuff is missed. On the Central line most of the stations appear to be getting some form of exciting metal sheeting for the ceilings a la Queensway and Lancaster Gate. Now i have noticed that the sheeting in its nice white colour doesn't look too easy to clean (Smooth Tiles - Easy, Textured Painted Metal Surface - No Thanks) and to be honest most of the stuff that has been put in is FILTHY and has not been cleaned at all. WHY? At Bond Street they have put this white metal in for only a short hight, left in the nice but filthy red wiring covers, why not clean them up? (the metal sheeting here is a disgrace its absolutely filthy) What i am trying to get at is that why can't these things (stations) be cleaned and have fixtures and fittings cleaned when needed rather than leaving it to such a point that replacement is the only option. Preventative maintainance is a good idea. Costs less in the long term surely. I don't buy a car, not maintain the engine, because i accept that i will put a new one in when the original breaks. (well i hope you get the idea) The worst thing about it is the lack of respect for Heritage, this was shown clearly in Lancaster Gates treatment. Whinge Moan Gripe.... |
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Post by ongarparknride on Feb 9, 2007 13:51:39 GMT
Hi "edb" and others here.
It seems the LU "flagship" is the two "refurbished to original standards" Baker Street platforms that from my personal visits and pictures use yellow Sodium floodlighting to "recreate" the original lighting effect.
I particularly latch on to your mention of the "heritage" effect, because if it is healthy and safe, why not dedicate that station to show the history of the original construction of the line?
Specifically, its station tiling and furnishings?
I guess LU has close co-ordination between the H&S, Legal and Maintenance departments to decide "upgrading" priorities within the global budget.
Shame the historians' input: "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" doesn't seem to figure.
After all, had machine room cleaning been carried out, arguably the tragic King's Cross Fire Disaster would not have occurred.
A possible source of SERIOUS concern remains that OK, wooden escalator parts have since been replaced with metal, but if the underlying cleaning still does not take place, then the essential root of the problem has not been addressed. Yes, ban smoking, but that is one step away from banning passengers, period. After all, LU would run really smoothly if the passengers were abolished. :-)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2007 14:36:58 GMT
Good examples of refurbishment?
That's a very subjective statement. Personally I prefer that we create some heritage today for the future, so I like station refurbs like Knightsbridge.
However Stockwell hasn't changed greatly - a good example of a refurbishment?
Went past Bethnal Green the other day and the tiles looked a close match to the originals.
Just to clarify the whole topic however. Stations will fall into 2 categories, they're either listed buildings or their not.
I work at a Holden listed station and we're embarking on refurb work in the next 18 months. I have personally shown around on 2 occasions people from English Heritage. So you can assume any refurb work will only be done with their approval.
My last station wasn't a listed building so for the refurb work only the LT museum was consulted.
To answer the cleaning issue - the station cleaners will not be reasonable to clean a new asset until it has been approved by LU. Before that it remains the property of the company who installs it. So during "works in progress" stage the company installing the item is responsible for cleaning/ maintaining it. Once it's been accepted the responsibility changes to the normal processes.
As for cleaning faults, there are 3 types of fault: 1) A normal cleaning fault. 2) An urgent cleaning fault, such as a spillage and 3) A contravention fault. A SERIOUS fault that could result in station closure.
To answer Kens, sorry O,P,N,R's machines rooms are inspected by the station supervisor at least every 3 hours. Dirt in a machine room is seen as a cleaning fault. Fluff and a build up in grease is seen as a contravention fault. JNP, on our end of the line anyway, inspect the escalator dust trays twice a week, a visual inspection is carried out every week and a more in depth inspection happens every 6 months.
In addition, the LFB have a dedicated team who inspect the station about every year and the local fire brigade inspect the station as they see fit.
In the past 6 months I've had both the dedicated team and the local fire station inspect the station, while I was on duty. The lead fire officer told me that he was 'impressed' at the way LU handle fire safety since Kings Cross. He had been inspecting my local station annually since Kings Cross and now he only came down when they had new fire fighters and only inspect the escalators.
From a totally personal opinion - and not LU speak - safety on the stations is taken VERY seriously. The systems in place, plus the staff training is 100%.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2007 18:20:10 GMT
A good refurb... None that I can think of -
Lancaster Gate has been ruined, so has Chalk Farm, Camden Town, because there is no detail in the tiles... Warren Street, they couldnae be bothered to get new tiled painted with Warren Street, so they just framed the old one and tiled new tiles around it - at Chalk Farm, replicas of the fired on lettering was provided, but the rest of the tiles were just patched up.
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Post by Tubeboy on Feb 9, 2007 18:23:08 GMT
Hmm DMC Tiling and TL have a lot to answer for!! As for Kentish Town, tiles above the name friezes were left untouched, leaving a half completed look!  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2007 18:33:04 GMT
Exactly the same with Chalk farm, TB... they couldnae be bothered to cut the tile to fit round the archway detail, so just splodged some cement in the gap and sort of brushed it over with similar looking paint... they also did a half job here, the rings around the tunnel vault were left untouched, so the half tiles that meet this, look really odd. It's all disgustingly cheap and shoddy, I sent an e-mail to TFL about it and they said the general public wouldnt notice such minute details... Well, if I can see, it, I'm sure Fred Kite will see it too!
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Post by edb on Feb 9, 2007 18:34:36 GMT
I'm really worried they will ruin the interior of Marble Arch.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2007 18:38:32 GMT
Well, I'm now armed with a digital camera, so will be keeping an eye on refurbs from this point on... Just wonder if they'll mess up Covent Garden now the Bureau De Change has been booted out!
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Post by Tubeboy on Feb 9, 2007 18:42:09 GMT
Fred Kite, is that a term for Joe Public?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2007 18:46:08 GMT
Yesss!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2007 1:01:18 GMT
Heritage? Make it all nice, modern and bright like the SSL platforms at KX! ;D
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2007 17:59:52 GMT
Heritage? Make it all nice, modern and bright like the SSL platforms at KX! ;D And hide the 1940's tiles behind it? Yes, treasure to be found in a few years time! I'd like to remove all the metal sheeting at Charing Cross and Euston and reveal the original tiles, I'd guess they are still there, hiding? |
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Post by edb on Feb 10, 2007 22:10:48 GMT
And hide the 1940's tiles behind it? Yes, treasure to be found in a few years time! Sound's like a Job for TIME TEAM  ;D   ;D I'd like to remove all the metal sheeting at Charing Cross and Euston and reveal the original tiles, I'd guess they are still there, hiding? I'd love to remove it from Holborn, a pretty station i think. One place i'd really like to work is behind the LU roundall above the entrance to Holborn, better than where i am now. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2007 22:40:26 GMT
Agreed - ditch the panelling at Holborn and reveal that lovely Yerkes pattern, by all means.
You can keep the panelling on the Central Line platforms - I don't think they have anything special underneath them.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2007 22:42:59 GMT
probably the standard square biscuit coloured tiles...
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2007 0:57:07 GMT
At Embankment westbound there is at least part of the earlier tiling visible when the cleaners access their store by opening one of the modern metal panels. The old platform wall even has older style Embankment roundels!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2007 0:04:39 GMT
N/B end of Bakerloo at EMB, there is also a tiny fraction of old tiling visible, being the headwall panelling...
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