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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2014 19:41:18 GMT
Was it given over to Network Rail on Overground takeover from LU or to a third party?
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Post by Tubeboy on Nov 5, 2014 19:54:47 GMT
I was under the impression NR own it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2014 19:56:25 GMT
TfL/RfL own the core section between Dalston Jct and New Cross Gate/New Cross/Old Kent Rd Jct, the rest is owned by Network Rail.
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Post by bassmike on Nov 6, 2014 14:01:33 GMT
It is actually owned by a Mr Arnold Thribb of Penge and his heirs and assassins in perpetuity and is leased to N.R and Tfl on an ongoing basis.
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Post by grahamhewett on Nov 6, 2014 15:30:57 GMT
bassmike - like Hatch End therefore? (HE really is owned by someone's heirs and hashashins...)
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Post by bicbasher on Nov 6, 2014 21:57:17 GMT
Stations inside the core are owned by TfL as well.
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Post by phil on Nov 14, 2014 2:27:59 GMT
I was under the impression NR own it. Nope! - a common misconception. Please remember that the section from New Cross / New Cross Gate up to Shoreditch in pre TfL days was owned by London Underground Limited (as sucessors to the origional Metroploitan and Metropolitan District railway companies). Although it is true that as built the GER, LBSCR and SER all had involvement in the beginning, British Rail had long given up any ownership rights (other than in the vacinity of New Cross Gate / New Cross Stations) way before privatisation let alone TfL, arrived on the scene. The northern section running from Hoxton through to Dalston also escaped from NR ownership - in this case becasue the Broad Street to Dalston line was shut by British Rail. Now in normal circumstances that would have been the end of things and the viaducts demolished to release development space - but even back in the early 90s it was obvious that the former Broad Street approaches had potential to be combined with the under utilised ELL Underground line. Accordingly ownership was transferred from British Rail to the local councils, who then sold / transferred it to TfL upon the establishment of said organisation. The viaducts constructed to link the two bits were designed and constucted for TfL who naturally owned the completed structures (just as the entire Crossrail tunnel network, i.e. Royal Oak to Pudding Mill lane plus pratically the entire Abbey Wood branch will also be owned by TfL NOT Network Rail. Thus the only bits of the ELL Network Rail actually own is the section from Dalston - Highbury (where it runs alongside the NLL) and a few small bits of track around New Cross gate and at the junction with the SLL. All signalling on the route is controlled from the TfL owned and operated (via the LO concession) depot / control centre at New Cross gate - and I believe that even the signallers controlling the line are LO staff. The only involvement NR thus have with the core of the ELL is that they have been contracted to maintain and provide faulting cover for the infrastructure (in a similar manor to HS1) - mainly because the revitalised ELL uses traditional 'mainline railway' signalling equipment, etc and it makes more sense to have NR do it than have TfL do it in house so to speak (i.e. by the underground).
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Post by redbond on Nov 14, 2014 8:53:05 GMT
All signalling on the route is controlled from the TfL owned and operated (via the LO concession) depot / control centre at New Cross gate - and I believe that even the signallers controlling the line are LO staff. The only involvement NR thus have with the core of the ELL is that they have been contracted to maintain and provide faulting cover for the infrastructure (in a similar manor to HS1) - mainly because the revitalised ELL uses traditional 'mainline railway' signalling equipment, etc and it makes more sense to have NR do it than have TfL do it in house so to speak (i.e. by the underground). Not quite correct. The East London Line is signaled by Network Rail signalers. Maintenance of the infrastructure on the "core" route is contracted out to Carillion.
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Post by longhedge on Nov 14, 2014 13:47:44 GMT
All signalling on the route is controlled from the TfL owned and operated (via the LO concession) depot / control centre at New Cross gate - and I believe that even the signallers controlling the line are LO staff. The only involvement NR thus have with the core of the ELL is that they have been contracted to maintain and provide faulting cover for the infrastructure (in a similar manor to HS1) - mainly because the revitalised ELL uses traditional 'mainline railway' signalling equipment, etc and it makes more sense to have NR do it than have TfL do it in house so to speak (i.e. by the underground). Not quite correct. The East London Line is signaled by Network Rail signalers. Maintenance of the infrastructure on the "core" route is contracted out to Carillion. Please explain what is meant by `signalled by Network rail Signallers. I have a working timetable from a couple of years ago, where the ELL trains are accepted from `Dalston Western Connector`, which I assume is where the ownership boundary is at Dalston. Are you saying that the whole of the ELL is controlled from a Network Rail box.
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Post by bicbasher on Nov 14, 2014 14:07:02 GMT
I was under the impression that NR signalers operate the signals from New Cross Gate and work in conjunction with TfL/London Rail and LOROL staff in the same building?
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Post by Chris M on Nov 14, 2014 14:31:32 GMT
longhedge I think what happens is that Highbury to Dalston is controlled by Network Rail signallers working the North London Line (based in Upminster IECC), while Dalston to New Cross/New Cross Gate/Whatever-the-junction-to-Clapham-is-called is controlled by different Network Rail signallers based at New Cross Gate.
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Post by longhedge on Nov 14, 2014 19:12:18 GMT
longhedge I think what happens is that Highbury to Dalston is controlled by Network Rail signallers working the North London Line (based in Upminster IECC), while Dalston to New Cross/New Cross Gate/Whatever-the-junction-to-Clapham-is-called is controlled by different Network Rail signallers based at New Cross Gate. Thanks for explanation. NOTE: The `junction to Clapham Junction` is called Silwood.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 12:46:18 GMT
The section between Silwood Junction and Old Kent Rd Junction is still under the ELL signaller so the boundary is really at the last signal protecting Old Kent Rd Junction on the up Silwood. This is under London Bridge signal box.
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Post by redbond on Nov 15, 2014 12:49:03 GMT
longhedge I think what happens is that Highbury to Dalston is controlled by Network Rail signallers working the North London Line (based in Upminster IECC), while Dalston to New Cross/New Cross Gate/Whatever-the-junction-to-Clapham-is-called is controlled by different Network Rail signallers based at New Cross Gate. Thanks for explanation. NOTE: The `junction to Clapham Junction` is called Silwood. All of the East London Line, up to Highbury platforms 1 and 2, is controlled by signallers at New Cross Gate. Platforms 7 and 8 are controlled by Upminster.
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