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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2014 19:37:26 GMT
Okay this may sound odd, but I was waiting on the Canada Water southbound platform yesterday afternoon, a northbound train for Dalston J. pulled up in the opposite platform. As it left, I could've sworn I saw a driver (someone?) sitting in the rear cabin. I know there's a couple of LO operators here, so is this possible? Does this happen? I have a couple of theories...
a) It was a New Cross-Dalston service, and because of the short length, he was there for the reverse
b) I'm losing my marbles...
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Post by melikepie on Jan 25, 2014 19:56:17 GMT
...or c) Drivers/operators are also occasionally located in the rear cab on all train services for some reason. Odd but normal.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2014 20:02:34 GMT
Some diagrams require drivers to travel as a passenger from NXG to Dalston Jct in order to pick up their train. They may travel in the rear cab which is what you would have seen.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2014 23:07:24 GMT
378 drivers explanation is the most likely, although in addition you sometimes get driver managers carrying out surreptitious assessments from the rear cab as well.
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Post by causton on Jan 26, 2014 2:35:09 GMT
Might have been a driver travelling to/from work, or as part of their duty. I know First Capital Connect and London Underground staff do this, so I am sure LO staff are allowed as long as they are not in the front cab distracting the driver!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2014 15:49:51 GMT
Might have been a driver travelling to/from work, or as part of their duty. I know First Capital Connect and London Underground staff do this, so I am sure LO staff are allowed as long as they are not in the front cab distracting the driver! Strictly speaking the travelling to and from work is not permitted (although that's not to say it doesn't happen, especially if it's peak rush). Even when passing as part of their duty the driver in the rear cab is meant to inform their colleague driving the train. It's not completely unknown for someone to accidentally knock one of the emergency plungers in the rear cab (whilst I've not done it in that situation I have knocked the plunger in error on the second man side when putting on my hi-vis before going trackside).
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Post by melikepie on Jan 26, 2014 16:04:56 GMT
I wonder if any trains anywhere have tried driving in both directions at the same time (not just on London Overground).
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jan 26, 2014 19:59:43 GMT
I wonder if any trains anywhere have tried driving in both directions at the same time (not just on London Overground). I understand the cabs are interlocked so that you can't switch in one cab unless all the others in the train are switched out. A colleague did once tell me of an incident he was involved in, in which someone coupled two Class 117s together by the brake and control connections but forgot the screw coupler. I'm not sure where the coupling up was done, presumably at Paddington although it could have been done beforehand. For some reason the lead (London-end) unit was less powerful both in engine and brake force than the other (or maybe more heavily loaded). All went well until the driver applied the brakes for the first stop (in those days Westbourne Park), when the lead unit started to gain on the other, and pulled the brake and control connections apart.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Jan 26, 2014 20:14:38 GMT
I wonder if any trains anywhere have tried driving in both directions at the same time (not just on London Overground). Not quite what you are thinking of, but there was a tug of war with two steam locos trying to haul away a third steam loco that was chained to the tracks and also pulling in the opposite direction. This was March 1909 in New York state. Story is in the left hand column of this newspaper
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jan 26, 2014 21:23:58 GMT
I wonder if any trains anywhere have tried driving in both directions at the same time (not just on London Overground). Not quite what you are thinking of, but there was a tug of war with two steam locos trying to haul away a third steam loco that was chained to the tracks and also pulling in the opposite direction. This was March 1909 in New York state. Story is in the left hand column of this newspaperA similar dispute (without the tug of war) happened at Nottingham in 1852, when the Midland "imprisoned" a GNR loco to whose presence the management took exception. It was apparently possible for one of the LNWR's Webb Compounds to have a tug of war with itself, thanks to independantly driven driving axles.
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Jan 26, 2014 21:36:37 GMT
I wonder if any trains anywhere have tried driving in both directions at the same time (not just on London Overground). Yes, it happens every time multiple units are coupled; it's called the pull-apart test.
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Post by redbond on Jan 26, 2014 22:00:41 GMT
We are allowed to travel in the rear cab as part of our duties. Occasionally some spare drivers are required to run a test train after maintenance, they'll have a driver in the rear cab, run up to Highbury or Dalston and then change ends straight away to get out as quickly as possible.
The 378s won't allow you to 'liven up' a cab if there is a key in the other cab, although they won't always tell you. I once got caught out by this after relieving a driver at Dalston. I walked up to the platform end cab, put the key in, nothing happened and all I could hear was the passcom alarm sounding. Odd I thought, there were no BIL lights flashing. I keyed off and on a few times, same thing. I then walked down through the train to check all the alarms and it wasn't until I got to the rear carriage that I could hear the fault alarm sounding in the rear cab. The other driver had left the key in and train on, obviously distracted by my presence when he pulled in.
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Post by Chris M on Jan 27, 2014 11:08:34 GMT
I wonder if any trains anywhere have tried driving in both directions at the same time (not just on London Overground). Yes, it happens every time multiple units are coupled; it's called the pull-apart test. That's just one unit trying to move away from the other, not both trying to move.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2014 12:28:52 GMT
There are numerous stories (many exaggerated) from BR days of diesel loco jumpers being wired up internally "back to front" so that when they were multipled with another loco they pulled in opposite directions.
I am aware of a similar problem with HST power cars in the very early days on the WR caused by sticking contactors although they didn't pull in opposite directions, one just acted like a mobile load bank and presented so much rolling resistance that speed would not exceed about 30 mph.
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Post by melikepie on Jan 31, 2014 22:16:51 GMT
Randomly I remember a scene which involved a driver in the rear cab of a Eurostar (or London bound TGV as they in film called it) which involved a helicopter chasing the train through the Channel Tunnel. The movie was the first Mission Impossible.
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Post by james66526 on Apr 29, 2014 20:31:27 GMT
I wonder if any trains anywhere have tried driving in both directions at the same time (not just on London Overground). On an LUL battery loco I have had one set of motors trying to go forward and the other set in reverse when I opened up the power controller. The loco just sat there juddering with a bit of wheelspin!
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Antje
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Post by Antje on May 1, 2014 11:35:21 GMT
378driver's theory is the most likely IMO: either way, it's not like that LO has started training drivers to literally drive trains backwards.
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roythebus
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Post by roythebus on May 3, 2014 10:25:45 GMT
We used to be trained to drive backwards. If the deadman or controls in the leading cab were defective, the guard would drive from the rear cab, the driver would brake from the leading cab (pre-electronic whizz-controlled stock).
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