Additional trains for Northern and Jubilee ?

I must admit I was surprised but Modern Railways are usually fairly reliable.

I can't recall it mentioning driverless trains. I don't have it with me atm so I can't confirm. I'll check later if no-one else has done so in the meantime.

This all sounds highly unlikely, it’s not as if Alstom or anyone else have got a shed load of tube stock stuck away at the back just in case LUL needed some more, they’d have to be ordered. If you stuck another stock on the Northern and/or Jubilee then the TOps would all have to be trained on that stock, just as up until the District Line gets it’s S stock TOps have to be licenced for C and D stock.

I wouldn’t put any credit in anything Boris says, he’s either purposefully being misleading and vague or he really has no idea what he’s talking about. Jubilee and Northern are well down the queue for new trains, if and when the driverless system currently being developed up at Old Dalby works the Bakerloo will be first and the Piccadilly next.

If additional trains were considered for the Jubilee, they would more or less have to be built to match the 96 stock design, just as the previous 4x additional trains were. Of course this could raise issues with the supply of certain components, and the cost of a small order may also prove uneconomic.

The Northern Line is more complicated, as any fleet changes are also tied in with the fortunes of the Battersea extension and plans to separate the Northern Line.

If LU does so, then push on if they want to. Bringing more fleet will cost an arm and a leg but will of course, give more trains but they won't eliminate overcrowding. If they will produce more 95 stock, they should produce it when the extension to Battersea starts coming up. Unfortunately, that should be in about in the 2020s.

I think the Jubilee Line may be tight - existings depots and sidings are well utilised, there's little room for expansion at Stratford, and I assume any spare space at Neasden would be taken up by SSR trains. There is the option to stable potentially up to 4 trains at Charing Cross, though this option has complications.

The Northern Line should have space, there are potentially 3x sidings at Golders Green which are not used for stabling, and there is space for a modest number of additional sidings at High Barnet and Highgate without too much work being required.

I've now had the chance to read the report again and it does not mention driverless trains or the mayor.

It is likely that the various tube stocks will be moved around.

I wouldn't be surprised to see different trains on the Central Line sooner rather than later.

Given the way that Hitachi have provided new traction systems for trains on SouthEastern, I am sure that 15 year old trains could be made better than new.

I’d say it is highly unlikely that Tube stock will be moved around. As they all vary TOps are only licenced for the stock they work on and until recently the only Line that was trained on more than one stock was the District where the TOps got an extra training for C and D stock.

The introduction of S stock on the Sub Surface Lines means that any TOp on those lines can transfer around and only need to learn route knowledge. The last I heard was that the Bakerloo and Piccadilly will be next to get new trains then the Central/W&C but as Mike Brown pointed out to the GLA Transport Committee with the Treasury cutting billions from TfL’s budget over the life of the current parliament LUL’s piggy bank is empty.

I don't expect to be driving anything other than 92s up to Epping and back for the next 15 years.

The 92 TS will be around for a while yet. Will be 20 years since they entered service next April - I remember being there for their second day in service! Where did the time go . . .

They were the first new trains that I ever saw coming into service, so part of me always thinks of them as new!

Agreed. I remember them coming into service and they looked shiney and new but they've not aged well. Come 2025 they will be due for replacement.

The body panels at the end of the cars were built up of 7 parts where as the new ones are built up of 3 parts. The refreshed units look decent and I'd be surprised if they didn't last for the next 15 years.

Me too. I will be very suprised and I will cry like crazy if they do.

I didn't know that LUL operated up lines and down lines...

The 1959 (and the three 1956) stock trains were moved onto the Northern Line so the Piccadilly Line could receive new purpose built stock for the Heathrow Extension and so that replacement of the life expired 1938 stock could continue. Generally LUL does not like to mix stock on a particular line as it creates many problems.

The Northern Line was actually equipped with 63 trains of 1972 stock because the Mk2 stock also operated on the Northern until the 1959 stock started to move over. It was a difficult time for LT and the country as the reliability of the 1938 stock was so poor it had been dubbed the misery line! At the same time, Metro-Cammell had to be kept in business hence why the 1972mk2 stock was built 5 years early to operate on the Jubilee Line.

The original plan had been to refurbish, rewire and repaint the 1938 stock silver to work with the 1959 stock until the late 90s when the entire lot would be replaced. I can't see LUL wanted to have a joint stock on the Northern. It would make sense to split the Northern and provide Evo trains on one branch only. There would most likely be an excess of 1995 stock which I don't believe could easily be used with the 1996 stock as the equipment is different and hard to procure. My guess is that we might see some trains of 1995 withdrawn!