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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2012 16:14:15 GMT
... and slow services?
Exceptionally long title aside, does anyone know why the metropolitan is the only line with non stop, fast services as standard?
ELL
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metman
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Post by metman on Sept 2, 2012 16:22:11 GMT
Well there are relatively few fast trains these days.  The main reason is that the Met was a main line railway running initially through fields. The stations were miles apart and the tracks were shared with another mainline company. The Met was only absorbed into LT in 1933. In order to move passengers quickly fast non-stop trains were run. Many other lines - including the tube lines also used to run fast trains with non-stopped some stations but this was found to be counterproductive as only the Met had multiple tracks in places and a quieter timetable. |
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Post by andypurk on Sept 2, 2012 16:24:01 GMT
... and slow services? Exceptionally long title aside, does anyone know why the metropolitan is the only line with non stop, fast services as standard? Because it is the only line with more than a pair of running lines? It is hard to run a high frequency service, with fast trains, if those trains catch the slower ones up. Of course, the Piccadilly line also runs non-stop services from Hammersmith - Acton Town. |
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Post by madandy on Sept 2, 2012 16:42:22 GMT
I always think the Piccadilly could be enhanced by it's no-stopping and not serving Gloucester Road and Barons Court and maybe having half the Heathrow branch running fast to Hounslow...... South Kensington - Earls Court - Hammersmith - Acton Town - Hounslow East seems very plausible.
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metman
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Post by metman on Sept 2, 2012 16:44:31 GMT
That was abandoned years ago. The piccadilly used to non stop many stations but fast trains were held up by stopping services. Management like all stations to service all stations.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2012 17:19:03 GMT
Shame really, but I see why it makes sense that all lines don't have non stop services anymore.
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Post by superteacher on Sept 2, 2012 18:44:18 GMT
That was abandoned years ago. The piccadilly used to non stop many stations but fast trains were held up by stopping services. Management like all stations to service all stations. Exactly - virtually no time was gained from these services. |
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Post by harrowman on Sept 2, 2012 18:50:36 GMT
Well there are relatively few fast trains these days. It is only relatively recently the fast Amersham service has been mainly confined to peak hours. |
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Post by superteacher on Sept 2, 2012 18:51:24 GMT
Well there are relatively few fast trains these days. It is only relatively recently the fast Amersham service has been mainly confined to peak hours. Yes, from December 2011. |
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Post by peterc on Sept 2, 2012 20:11:25 GMT
IIRC the District was intended to have fast services but as it became part of the Yerkes empire the new track was used for the Picadilly instead.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Sept 3, 2012 21:50:55 GMT
IIRC the District was intended to have fast services but as it became part of the Yerkes empire the new track was used for the Picadilly instead. Indeed, one could argue that the Deep Level district was built, at least as far as South Kensington, but was given a catchier name. To the east, C2C provides the fast service |
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Post by A60stock on Sept 4, 2012 17:36:43 GMT
any reason that yesterday 3rd sept, at around 2015 at finchely road, there were two FAST amersham trains within 5 minutes of each other? on top of this neither stopped at wembley park as well, delays i pressume?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2012 18:53:59 GMT
My quick, and probably predictable, reply but the all stations service now running off peak is truly dreadful. Return of fast off peak services is essential.
Withdrawal of fast off peaks also raises issue of proper TfL accountability for services run outside London.
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metman
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Post by metman on Sept 6, 2012 19:33:54 GMT
Many trains this afternoon were running semi-fast (Amersham/Chesham due to a points problem I think. There was also a delay when staff had to get access to the track at Barbican.
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Post by trt on Sept 7, 2012 15:27:25 GMT
Yesterday evening, I saw a train at Farringdon where the platform DMI said Amersham (fast) and the display in the train itself said it was an Amersham all stations service.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2012 16:33:50 GMT
There did seem to be some issues yesterday. My Uxbridge - Aldgate stopped short and reversed at Moorgate instead of going the full distance. Thankfully though I was only going as far as Baker St!
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Post by superteacher on Sept 7, 2012 23:58:57 GMT
Yesterday evening, I saw a train at Farringdon where the platform DMI said Amersham (fast) and the display in the train itself said it was an Amersham all stations service. Sometimes the line controller will change the routing of the train and the DMI will show this new destination. More often than not, this gets done before the driver is told over the train radio. You often see a train described as Moorgate at, say, Wembley Park or Finchley Road while the train still shows Aldgate. On one occasion, a driver didn't know he was being reversed at Moorgate until he reached the junction signal in the tunnel, by which time it was too late to tell the passengers, who all had to trudge their way down and up the stairs at Moorgate. Driver was very apologetic, but said that he hadn't been told. Are drivers meant to look at the destinations shown on the platform, and radio through to control if there is a discrepancy? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2012 15:04:41 GMT
Are drivers meant to look at the destinations shown on the platform, and radio through to control if there is a discrepancy? And similarly, are station staff expected to react to any such discrepancy? When I lived in Chicago, the L would every so often change the stopping pattern of trains - and this would be announced to tain crew via station announcements - which would end "conductor repeat the announcement" (to ensure it had got through) Getting back to the topic, it could said that the District and Jubilee lines run slow trains where the Piccadilly and Met run fast ones... As has been said, to run non-stop trains successfully, an extra track (or better, pair) is required. I recall a comment made of the District (I think) when it had non-stopping trains - that it had stopping trains, which stopped at stations, and non-stopping ones, which stopped between them. |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Sept 8, 2012 16:34:10 GMT
Getting back to the topic, it could said that the District and Jubilee lines run slow trains where the Piccadilly and Met run fast ones... Other examples, where an Underground service parallels another operator's limited stop service - I will use the present operators' names: FCC/Piccadilly (between Finsbury park and Kings Cross) C2C/District (Fenchurch St - Upminster) Central/Chiltern (North Acton) - South Ruislip- West Ruislip Victoria/S Eastern (Vic - Brixton) SLL/S Eastern (Vic to Denmark Hill) Jubilee/South Eastern (Waterloo to London Br) DLR/C2C The first two were built for that purpose, the others sort of happened |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2012 21:15:27 GMT
As has been said, to run non-stop trains successfully, an extra track (or better, pair) is required. Although ideally this is the case, it is not always possible. A classic example of a work-around used to fit faster trains into one pair of tracks can be seen on the slow lines between Shenfield and Liverpool St. Although fast trains skip all-station with the exception of Stratford, some of the slow trains also skip stops. Trains alternately skip Maryland/Forest Gate/Manor Park and Seven Kings/Goodmayes - and in the contra-peak direction Chadwell Heath is also skipped. This reduces journey times by approximately 10%, not insignificant given the limited number of trains available during peak times. This gives a frequency of 12 tph overall, with 6 tph available to the skipped stations. Apologies for the slightly O/T nature of this reply (yes this is not on a tube line)... Cheers, TSM EDIT: This practice only occurs during peak periods |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2012 6:55:30 GMT
As has been said, it's possible where infrastructure is provided. I think one of the scandals of the off peak all stations Amersham/Chesham service is the infrastructure, recently upgraded, is now underused.
Evidence so far for Ricky to Amersham passengers is that billions of investment has led to slower trains with less seats!
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metman
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Post by metman on Sept 10, 2012 7:24:39 GMT
I've noticed recently that all Northbound Amersham/Chesham trains are running semi fast. Is there a problem with the points somewhere or has common sense prevailed?
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Post by allan60 on Sept 10, 2012 16:47:38 GMT
I've noticed recently that all Northbound Amersham/Chesham trains are running semi fast. Is there a problem with the points somewhere or has common sense prevailed? Is that still the case? Well, if that continues up to the 26th Sept then we will see the last A stock run semi fast through out its last day.  |
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Post by cooperman on Sept 12, 2012 22:30:45 GMT
I've noticed recently that all Northbound Amersham/Chesham trains are running semi fast. Is there a problem with the points somewhere or has common sense prevailed? All very commendable i'm sure if true. Although be aware that there is a danger of sitting at a station (past Ricky) to " Even out the Service" which is longer than the actual journey to the next Station. They (The Management) should be congratulated in Alienating the majority of Passengers they so stride to serve ( sic ). Come on lets be fair , they still think that holding N/B Chesham trains at Chalfont and Latimer for up to 10 mins while the S/B train comes down the single track acceptable .No wonder the Chiltern Train is packed .. Priceless ;D |
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