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Post by marri260 on Aug 3, 2012 21:45:34 GMT
Hi all, Firstly, this is my first post on this site so please be nice! I have read the forums with great interest for many years, and have eventually joined. This post does not actually have an awful lot to do with the Underground, but is slightly linked in the fact that it is about the site of the Croxley Rail link, and a depot where Bakerloo line trains used to stable overnight, which is why it is not in a specific line forum as it is linked to two lines. The pictures to accompany this post...hopefully the link works. imageshack.us/g/831/388mp.jpg/A few days ago, accompanied by my grandfather I walked the old LNWR line from Watford to Croxley Green, on what will in the future be the Croxley rail link. This is the forth time we have done the walk, and I have only posted a few pictures of the first walk on my Flickr site before I gave up on using it. However, in due course I will write a proper, conclusive report with photos. Anyway, just to the side of the site of Wiggenhall road depot once stood, there we found three parallel tunnels. We were searching around in the undergrowth where ridiculous amounts of general waste and rubbish that have been dumped, when I noticed a brick built pit filled with rubbish. It was more of a trench, with walled sides. I then attempted to walk towards the end of the trench, which was 5 or 6 meters in front of me. However, whilst walking towards the end of the pit, I became aware that I was walking on concrete, not solid ground. The concrete then ended in a deeper and wider, but shorter pit filled with rubble, with the walled trench running alongside to the right also abruptly ending, the walls collapsed inwards on themselves in huge chunks. I decided to clamber down into the wider trench to see what was down there, and turned around to face the way that I had just come from and was greeted with a tunnel face?! A peek inside the tunnel face led showed nothing but darkness stretching away below the concrete that I had walked to the deep pit on, meaning that the concrete I had walked on was infact the roof of this mysterious tunnel. Bending down to peer through the tunnel opening, nothing could be made out as it was too dark to see, however taking a picture with the flash on revealed the insides of the tunnel excellently. The tunnels were about 10 meters long as the pictures show. There were infact three of there tunnels next to eachother, each separated by a walled trench. Each tunnel had the same construction. The site was where the Croxley depot would have been, if you Google earth it, its right at the back of the builders yard in the wooded bit. On one side of the depot, there was a spur leading to the Watford DC lines, allowing trains to come from Bushey all the way through to Croxley. This spur passed close to the side of the depot, and I believe that the location of the tunnels is between the side of the depot and the spur. Thinking about it, the 'deeper and wider pit' was probably not the start of the tunnels, as the steel girder inside the concrete is bent back and the concrete that forms the roof is in bits on the ground, indicating that the roof section had been smashed in, meaning that it was not the start of the tunnel, and the picture of the insides of the tunnel show that the rings that appear to form the mouth are infact supports. The brickwork was clearly old and something to do with the line, or possibly an air raid shelter?! What exactly they are though is what I'm trying to find out. Hoping that the wealth of knowledge on this site could help find some sort of answer. Sorry if this makes no sense or is hard to understand. Many thanks, Chris |
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Post by rapidtransitman on Aug 3, 2012 22:33:32 GMT
Very cool. The tunnels don't look very high.
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Post by marri260 on Aug 3, 2012 22:45:59 GMT
No, they were not. I didn't attempt to step inside the one tunnel that was accessible as it was full of flies, but I reckon that if I had, I would have been able to stand up as long as I stooped slightly?! This would mean that the tunnels are about 6 feet tall at a rough estimate. I will do some more research when I return to the site sometime next week.
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Post by bassmike on Aug 4, 2012 2:46:28 GMT
inspection pits?
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Post by harrowman on Aug 4, 2012 4:04:04 GMT
Hi all, Firstly, this is my first post on this site so please be nice! I have read the forums with great interest for many years, and have eventually joined. This post does not actually have an awful lot to do with the Underground, but is slightly linked in the fact that it is about the site of the Croxley Rail link, and a depot where Bakerloo line trains used to stable overnight, which is why it is not in a specific line forum as it is linked to two lines. The pictures to accompany this post...hopefully the link works. imageshack.us/g/831/388mp.jpg/A few days ago, accompanied by my grandfather I walked the old LNWR line from Watford to Croxley Green, on what will in the future be the Croxley rail link. This is the forth time we have done the walk, and I have only posted a few pictures of the first walk on my Flickr site before I gave up on using it. However, in due course I will write a proper, conclusive report with photos. Anyway, just to the side of the site of Wiggenhall road depot once stood, there we found three parallel tunnels. We were searching around in the undergrowth where ridiculous amounts of general waste and rubbish that have been dumped, when I noticed a brick built pit filled with rubbish. It was more of a trench, with walled sides. I then attempted to walk towards the end of the trench, which was 5 or 6 meters in front of me. However, whilst walking towards the end of the pit, I became aware that I was walking on concrete, not solid ground. The concrete then ended in a deeper and wider, but shorter pit filled with rubble, with the walled trench running alongside to the right also abruptly ending, the walls collapsed inwards on themselves in huge chunks. I decided to clamber down into the wider trench to see what was down there, and turned around to face the way that I had just come from and was greeted with a tunnel face?! A peek inside the tunnel face led showed nothing but darkness stretching away below the concrete that I had walked to the deep pit on, meaning that the concrete I had walked on was infact the roof of this mysterious tunnel. Bending down to peer through the tunnel opening, nothing could be made out as it was too dark to see, however taking a picture with the flash on revealed the insides of the tunnel excellently. The tunnels were about 10 meters long as the pictures show. There were infact three of there tunnels next to eachother, each separated by a walled trench. Each tunnel had the same construction. The site was where the Croxley depot would have been, if you Google earth it, its right at the back of the builders yard in the wooded bit. On one side of the depot, there was a spur leading to the Watford DC lines, allowing trains to come from Bushey all the way through to Croxley. This spur passed close to the side of the depot, and I believe that the location of the tunnels is between the side of the depot and the spur. Thinking about it, the 'deeper and wider pit' was probably not the start of the tunnels, as the steel girder inside the concrete is bent back and the concrete that forms the roof is in bits on the ground, indicating that the roof section had been smashed in, meaning that it was not the start of the tunnel, and the picture of the insides of the tunnel show that the rings that appear to form the mouth are infact supports. The brickwork was clearly old and something to do with the line, or possibly an air raid shelter?! What exactly they are though is what I'm trying to find out. Hoping that the wealth of knowledge on this site could help find some sort of answer. Sorry if this makes no sense or is hard to understand. Many thanks, Chris Very interesting, the only route I recall was the Bakerloo between Watford High Street and the depot, also the BR line to Watford West and Croxley Green. Can't remember when trains ran between Bushey and Croxley Green though. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2012 8:56:35 GMT
Having more than just a passing interest about this branch I was not aware of these tunnels. There is a lot of water in this area and they could well be drainage tunnels.
I have spoken to many people over the years about the Croxley Green Depot and more than one has told that there was a shooting range under the depot! I have never seen any evidence to support this however at least 2 independent sources have said the same thing.
I know Douglas Stuckey the co-author of the West of Watford book and he is a wealth of knowledge on this area so I will check with him to see what he knows.
As you have been visiting this forum for a while I am sure you are aware of my layout based on elements of both the Croxley Green, Rickmansworth Church Street branches.
If you do visit model railway shows where we are exhibiting the layout please come say hello.
XF
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Post by marri260 on Aug 4, 2012 17:41:40 GMT
I know for a fact that they are not the old inspection pits of the depot as they face away at an angle of 90 degrees to the direction in which the roads for the depot used to run.
The reason you may not be able to recall trains running between Bushey and Croxley Green is because the spur allowing these running's to take place was removed well before the rest of the line was closed.
XF, I have alot of admiration for your layout, it is simply brilliant! I once had the thought of doing something similar myself based on the Croxley Green branch but decided to stick to my Horndy Dublo layout. My grandfather's first thought was that it was something to do with water or drainage, so that is a possibility, and wow never knew that, another possibility. I would love to find more out about the shooting range! I have never actually read the book, as i have never got round to getting hold of a copy, but have read about it and it seems a good source of information. Perhaps he could shed some light on the topic yes. I did briefly see your layout at London Transport's Acton depot open day in March of this year, but regrettably I did not come over for many reasons, mainly due to the fact that it would have been difficult to have any kind of conversation due to my task of showing my two younger brothers around. Hopefully I will be at a show where the layout is soon.
Chris
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Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2012 8:50:16 GMT
Hi Chris,
Having re-examined your photos I think that these might well be what was the shooting range under the depot.
What is the precise location where this photos were taken - as I might go and have a look for myself?
Thanks for your kind comments about Croxley Wiggenhall Road Depot we will be at the 3 Spires Show in Cornwall on 18/19th August and a little nearer home at the Northolt Show on 8th September so hopefully you might be able to make that Show
Regards,
XF
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Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2012 14:40:22 GMT
I wonder where the sofas in the first photo came from?
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Post by marri260 on Aug 8, 2012 12:19:04 GMT
The sofas did make me laugh yes, I would imagine they were used by some youths messing about down there?! Nigel, That is a possibility, I don't really know what to say as you know alot more about the shooting range than me! I will try my best to attend yes, thanks for the notice. Hopefully this will help you, and anyone else who wants to have a look at the tunnels themselves. This screenshot of google earth isn't great, but the area I have rubbed out is where I believe the tunnels to be. Rubbing the image out is not ideal, but its the best I could do so sorry! This is only a rough location, as when you are there on the tracks surrounded by trees and rubbish it is abit disorientating and hard to know exactly where you are.  So, if you reach the two bridges, 3 and 3A, walk towards Watford High Street junction on 3A along where the old tracks of the depot would have been, until you come to yet another pile of rubbish, this one though with these two cable drums in the pile.   When you reach these cable drums, to your right should be a large wooded area that supprisingly is clear of rubbish, where the depot would have stood. Walk in the direction as if you were waking into the old depot, and you should see this. I think it is the remains of some sort of cable reel?  When you have passed this, carry on walking forwards and you should come to these, with lots of smashed up pottery around them.   When you have reached here, look around you carefully and you should be able to make out the walled trench in the ground.  From here, you are there, just walk forward in the direction that the above photo is looking then you are at the tunnels. Sounds simple doesn't it? I'm sure this probably wont be needed, they shouldn't be too hard to find with abit of careful looking, but this is still here to help! Regards, Chris |
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Post by marri260 on Aug 8, 2012 12:20:33 GMT
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Post by harrowman on Aug 8, 2012 13:23:33 GMT
The sofas did make me laugh yes, I would imagine they were used by some youths messing about down there?! Seems more likely to be fly tipping. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2012 17:03:32 GMT
Those are probably stolen cable reels that have been dumped after being found to be 1- worthless, or 2- unsellable.
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Post by marri260 on Aug 8, 2012 19:11:00 GMT
Yes it is definatley fly tipping, the site of the old depot is now some sort of builders yard, I guess right at the back is where all the things they don't want go... there's tonnes and tonnes of just pure rubbish there.
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Post by angelislington on Aug 17, 2012 22:59:18 GMT
Hopefully this will help you, and anyone else who wants to have a look at the tunnels themselves. This screenshot of google earth isn't great, but the area I have rubbed out is where I believe the tunnels to be. Rubbing the image out is not ideal, but its the best I could do so sorry! This is only a rough location, as when you are there on the tracks surrounded by trees and rubbish it is a bit disorientating and hard to know exactly where you are. I had a gander on Google Maps. If you plug in 51.646982,-0.398159 it will take you pretty much to the place you screengrabbed from Google Earth. Did you walk to it from the Wiggenhall Industrial Estate road (just to the north), or from the bit calling itself Wiggenhall Road Goods Yd (to the east)? |
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Fahad
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Post by Fahad on Oct 9, 2012 21:35:20 GMT
The sofas did make me laugh yes, I would imagine they were used by some youths messing about down there?! Nigel, That is a possibility, I don't really know what to say as you know alot more about the shooting range than me! I will try my best to attend yes, thanks for the notice. Hopefully this will help you, and anyone else who wants to have a look at the tunnels themselves. This screenshot of google earth isn't great, but the area I have rubbed out is where I believe the tunnels to be. Rubbing the image out is not ideal, but its the best I could do so sorry! This is only a rough location, as when you are there on the tracks surrounded by trees and rubbish it is abit disorientating and hard to know exactly where you are.  So, if you reach the two bridges, 3 and 3A, walk towards Watford High Street junction on 3A along where the old tracks of the depot would have been, until you come to yet another pile of rubbish, this one though with these two cable drums in the pile.   When you reach these cable drums, to your right should be a large wooded area that supprisingly is clear of rubbish, where the depot would have stood. Walk in the direction as if you were waking into the old depot, and you should see this. I think it is the remains of some sort of cable reel?  When you have passed this, carry on walking forwards and you should come to these, with lots of smashed up pottery around them.   When you have reached here, look around you carefully and you should be able to make out the walled trench in the ground.  From here, you are there, just walk forward in the direction that the above photo is looking then you are at the tunnels. Sounds simple doesn't it? I'm sure this probably wont be needed, they shouldn't be too hard to find with abit of careful looking, but this is still here to help! Regards, Chris I've fixed the images for you, to save anyone else having to look for them all in your Photobucket album |
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