Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2012 14:38:35 GMT
The more I think about it, the more I think the service on the Rayners Lane branch is poor. During most of the day there is only one train every ten minutes, compared to twice that to Heathrow (understandable) and three extra on the same branch as far as Northfields (why?)
Why not switch the Northfields short workings to Rayners Lane to give, say, 8 trains an hour on this branch, timetabled to interchange better with the Metropolitan Line?
Just a thought..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2012 22:25:24 GMT
The more I think about it, the more I think the service on the Rayners Lane branch is poor. During most of the day there is only one train every ten minutes, compared to twice that to Heathrow (understandable) and three extra on the same branch as far as Northfields (why?) Why not switch the Northfields short workings to Rayners Lane to give, say, 8 trains an hour on this branch, timetabled to interchange better with the Metropolitan Line? Just a thought.. 1.) the demand isn't there in the off peak on the Rayners branch 2.) the 3 extra trains ex Northfields would make 9tph to Rayners which would equate to 6 reversers per hour at Rayners turning around in 10 minutes at best and trying to mesh with an 8tph Met - not a great combination of pathing and robustness in the layover |
|
|
|
Post by crusty54 on Jul 1, 2012 5:28:50 GMT
research shows that a 10 minute service is acceptable in turn up and go terms for most people
|
|
metman
Global Moderator
5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
Posts: 7,400
|
Post by metman on Jul 1, 2012 9:59:39 GMT
Agreed. The Met provides the main service. 10 minutes is perfectly acceptable for Rayners Lane to Ealing Common. There are now 11tph between Rayners Lane and Uxbridge!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2012 11:10:51 GMT
Also in agreement!
However, with a 7½ min (8tph) Met service to Uxbridge, and to up the Picc service to 9tph (6½-7 min) to at least Rayners Lane don't marry very well with each other!
On a personal note, I remember when the Picc's were indeed every 7½ mins to Rayners Lane (15 min Uxb) in the 1950s and 1960s, MF evenings and off-peaks Saturdays, but I doubt if we will ever see 7½ mins (8tph) Piccs on the Rayners branch off peak again - although it would marry very well with the Met's current 7½ min (8tph) service.
|
|
|
|
Post by norbitonflyer on Jul 1, 2012 13:02:54 GMT
the trains from Wood Green to Uxbridge are a long distant memory I apprecaite that interchange at Kings Cross has never been particularly convenient, but was the direct train really the better option? |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2012 13:14:22 GMT
I should also point out that the MF midday off-peak to Rayners Lane was every 7½ mins (8tph) until November 1952. Then there was a shortage of guards and the service MF midday to Rayners Lane became every 9 mins [18 mins Uxb] - (the Met was also reduced from 15 to 18 mins, saving one train in service - 5xP6 instead of 6xP6).
When services reverted to 'normal' from May 1955, the Rayners Lane service MF midday was 10 mins, 10/20 Uxbridge (4tph). At the same time, the Met to Uxb reverted to every 15 mins.
Picc's to Uxb MF midday were withdrawn from March 1959.
It is also of interest that after the District stopped serving Hounslow in the peaks from October 1964, the Picc services on each western branch were very similar.
However, early-morning services favoured the Rayners Lane branch, with some early-morning trains from Hounslow being shuttles to Acton Town.
Come Heathrow, the Rayners Lane branch had the 'shuttles' early morning and that branch immediately became the Picc's poor relation. And, of course, the rest is history ......
|
|
|
|
Post by revupminster on Jul 1, 2012 16:22:17 GMT
I would like the Piccs withdrawn and terminated at Ealing Broadway leaving the Rayners Lane Branch to be taken over by the District S7's
|
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Jul 1, 2012 17:17:54 GMT
the trains from Wood Green to Uxbridge are a long distant memory I apprecaite that interchange at Kings Cross has never been particularly convenient, but was the direct train really the better option? Back then, there were only peak hour Met services from Kings Cross, so would have meant a change at Baker Street too. |
|
|
|
Post by ruislip on Jul 2, 2012 0:05:31 GMT
With the Met off-peak svc being 8tph to Uxbridge, has anyone considered sending only 2 Piccies out of the 6tph currently on this branch to Uxbridge?
|
|
|
|
Post by rheostar on Jul 2, 2012 7:34:14 GMT
I would like the Piccs withdrawn and terminated at Ealing Broadway leaving the Rayners Lane Branch to be taken over by the District S7's We were saying exactly the same thing only a few days ago. Makes more sense now that the Met and District will be using the same stock. Then the Picc could concentrate on the Heathrow service. |
|
|
|
Post by andypurk on Jul 2, 2012 8:25:32 GMT
I would like the Piccs withdrawn and terminated at Ealing Broadway leaving the Rayners Lane Branch to be taken over by the District S7's This would slow the journeys for the Rayners Lane branch, into central London, as the District line trains call at the intermediate stations between Hammersmith and Acton Town. |
|
|
|
Post by programmes1 on Jul 2, 2012 8:45:52 GMT
I would like the Piccs withdrawn and terminated at Ealing Broadway leaving the Rayners Lane Branch to be taken over by the District S7's This would slow the journeys for the Rayners Lane branch, into central London, as the District line trains call at the intermediate stations between Hammersmith and Acton Town. A small price to pay. |
|
|
|
Post by programmes1 on Jul 2, 2012 8:48:06 GMT
I would like the Piccs withdrawn and terminated at Ealing Broadway leaving the Rayners Lane Branch to be taken over by the District S7's How many extra S7s would be needed I think let the District keep Ealing Bdy as well and let the Picc have just Heathrows with more use of all 4 tracks between Acton-Northfields. There used to be 3 sidings west of Northfields 2 of which were lost when PMs came in. |
|
castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
Posts: 1,316
|
Post by castlebar on Jul 2, 2012 9:08:53 GMT
This thread seems to ignore the fantastic costs involved in making the Ealing Common-Rayners route suitable for any surface stock, which it currently isn't.
A complete waste of money which would be far better spent giving local people what they want, i.e., a pax connection from Uxbridge, Hillingdon & Ickenam to the Central enabling them to get to Greenford, Northolt Perivale (where many of them work- and this also applies in reverse), and now easy rail access to White City too. Stop the Piccs at Rayners with a few peaks to Ruislip. Half the W Ruislip centrals to Uxbridge via a new chord . A couple of Piccs thus released for extra Heathrow services. Problems all solved.
Sending Districts to UXB is just a bonkers waste of time, brainpower, money, effort, resources etc.
|
|
|
|
Post by programmes1 on Jul 2, 2012 9:57:56 GMT
This thread seems to ignore the fantastic costs involved in making the Ealing Common-Rayners route suitable for any surface stock, which it currently isn't. A complete waste of money which would be far better spent giving local people what they want, i.e., a pax connection from Uxbridge, Hillingdon & Ickenam to the Central enabling them to get to Greenford, Northolt Perivale (where many of them work- and this also applies in reverse), and now easy rail access to White City too. Stop the Piccs at Rayners with a few peaks to Ruislip. Half the W Ruislip centrals to Uxbridge via a new chord . A couple of Piccs thus released for extra Heathrow services. Problems all solved. Sending Districts to UXB is just a bonkers waste of time, brainpower, money, effort, resources etc. The cost of making North Ealing to Rayners Lane suitable for S stock I'm sure is less than connecting the Central like you say but if the number of journeys to where you say people travel then may out weigh, in the end I suppose it's all down to the marketing people who seem to make the decisions. |
|
Fahad
In memoriam
Posts: 459 
|
Post by Fahad on Jul 2, 2012 10:47:34 GMT
This thread seems to ignore the fantastic costs involved in making the Ealing Common-Rayners route suitable for any surface stock, which it currently isn't. A complete waste of money which would be far better spent giving local people what they want, i.e., a pax connection from Uxbridge, Hillingdon & Ickenam to the Central enabling them to get to Greenford, Northolt Perivale (where many of them work- and this also applies in reverse), and now easy rail access to White City too. Stop the Piccs at Rayners with a few peaks to Ruislip. Half the W Ruislip centrals to Uxbridge via a new chord . A couple of Piccs thus released for extra Heathrow services. Problems all solved. Sending Districts to UXB is just a bonkers waste of time, brainpower, money, effort, resources etc. Where does all of the cost come from? According to bassmike, all that is required is the lowering of the ballast. That sounds like a reasonably cheap operation |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2012 11:06:06 GMT
Cheap - you are joking!
|
|
Fahad
In memoriam
Posts: 459
|
Post by Fahad on Jul 2, 2012 11:13:14 GMT
Oh  why isn't it cheap? I was expecting it would just take a day or two of twenty or so minimum wage labourers' time It's still cheaper than rebuilding two bridges, right? |
|
castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
Posts: 1,316
|
Post by castlebar on Jul 2, 2012 11:19:03 GMT
"Oh why isn't it cheap? I was expecting it would just take a day or two of twenty or so minimum wage labourers' time" AAAAAARGGGHH!! After funding the film "Raise the Titanic", Sir Lew Grade said, "It would have been cheaper to have lowered the Atlantic" |
|
Fahad
In memoriam
Posts: 459
|
Post by Fahad on Jul 2, 2012 11:28:46 GMT
I'm not sure I understand how the costs of those two activities are related
|
|
|
|
Post by andypurk on Jul 2, 2012 18:29:24 GMT
This thread seems to ignore the fantastic costs involved in making the Ealing Common-Rayners route suitable for any surface stock, which it currently isn't. Except that Surface stock can physically cover the whole route, but with speed restrictions under a couple of bridges, meaning that passenger service is not currently possible. Remember that the route was designed for surface gauge stock and the costs would be nothing compared to all the other infrastructure modifications which have been undertaken for the S-Stock. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2012 18:58:21 GMT
I would like the Piccs withdrawn and terminated at Ealing Broadway leaving the Rayners Lane Branch to be taken over by the District S7's Not a bad idea. In the fullness of time that would allow the platforms to be adjusted to give level boarding without having to take into account the different floor heights between tube and S stock. |
|
Fahad
In memoriam
Posts: 459
|
Post by Fahad on Jul 2, 2012 19:39:18 GMT
Which compromise height problems would that allow the adjustment of?
Ealing Common could be made accessible by giving the Rayners Lane branch to the SSR and letting it retain the Ealing Broadway branch, sending all Piccs to Heathrow - is this at all viable?
Are there any other compromise height platforms on the shared Picc/Dist?
|
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Jul 2, 2012 19:52:08 GMT
It seems like a lot of money would need to spend just to inconvenience people!
|
|
|
|
Post by alfie on Jul 2, 2012 21:06:56 GMT
Which compromise height problems would that allow the adjustment of? Rayners Lane to Uxbridge. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2012 21:22:14 GMT
As someone who uses Ealing Broadway, I would sooner things stay as they are. The Central and District cover a greater area of Zone 1 than the Picc and Central do.
|
|
Fahad
In memoriam
Posts: 459
|
Post by Fahad on Jul 2, 2012 21:36:39 GMT
Which compromise height problems would that allow the adjustment of? Rayners Lane to Uxbridge. Oh, right, I'm a total pillock |
|
metman
Global Moderator
5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
Posts: 7,400
|
Post by metman on Jul 2, 2012 22:56:22 GMT
Adding extra milage to the District is a big NO in my book. Leave it as is!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2012 21:03:13 GMT
Adding extra milage to the District is a big NO in my book. Leave it as is! It has enough trouble maintaining reliability as it is. Most days sees the Piccadilly line serving District line stations. |
|
why isn't it cheap? I was expecting it would just take a day or two of twenty or so minimum wage labourers' time
