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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2012 0:38:41 GMT
There was a great programme on BBC2 tonight - The Secret History of Our Street - which was all about the Caledonian Road.
Part of it was about BR's plans in the 80's for a big redevelopment of Kings Cross and St Pancras following on from the success of the Broadgate development. The plan was eventually ditched, partially because of the property crash and partly because of campaigning by locals against it.
Does anyone know more about what was planned? It must have been one heck of a development to need to obliterate the bottom of the Cally Road
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Post by londonstuff on Jun 21, 2012 6:02:54 GMT
Not strictly on the topic of railways but just for your information, this was the worst programme by far out of the three that had gone on so far and really hit the lowest common denominator: old men talking about cows and calves and what to do with them  and a scumbag landlord who was held up to be some sort of hero. Last week's one on Camberwell Grove and the previous one about Deptford High Street, which are both still on iPlayer, are much more about the historical changes of the area, etc. and vastly better. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2012 19:25:10 GMT
Good, I still have the first two on my cable box waiting to be watched.
The landlord was an interesting character! I reckon we've not seen the last of him on TV, he'd be perfect for some sort of fly on the wall documentary
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Post by pwilliams on Jul 11, 2012 22:00:57 GMT
landlord was'nt some salt by the name of rachman was it - well known old property landlord.
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Post by ruislip on Jul 22, 2012 0:38:19 GMT
Was there, or are there, any plans to combine Kings Cross and St Pancras into one large NR terminus?
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Post by compsci on Jul 22, 2012 8:01:18 GMT
There were plans to shut St Pancras completely and turn it into (I think) a sports hall in the early 1990s. These plans were put on hold when St Pancras was selected as the long-term terminus for Eurostar shortly afterwards. Waterloo was always seen as a stopgap.
Going back in history, the Midland originally terminated in KX, sharing the line with the Nothern between Hitchin and KX. The Midland wanted independence and also wanted to show off a bit, which resulted in the construction of St Pancras, which was the last of the large termini. It was always comparatively quiet, hence the repeated proposals to close it in the days of BR. The hotel was used as offices by BR for many years because it became distinctly unfashionable owing to lack of plumbing, and this was never rectified until the recent conversion.
I can't see any plans to combine them happening now that a fortune has been spent on renovating both.
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Post by grahamhewett on Jul 22, 2012 10:23:25 GMT
Sorry. compsci, any such plans were some sort of journalistic fluff (I should know, I was in charge of BR planning at the time!) There was no spare capacity at either KX or Euston. There was a plan, inspired by Ferdinand Mount and Mrs Thatcher, in about 1987 to close Marylebone and substitute a busway for the GC mainline, but that is another story. We soon saw that one off...
GH
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Post by compsci on Jul 22, 2012 12:24:26 GMT
In that case I shouldn't believe everything I read in print! Though I probably have better things to do than check my entire bookshelf to find which book it was.
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Post by Tomcakes on Jul 22, 2012 13:48:22 GMT
In all honesty they are practically one station as it is; especially since we seem to have to accept long walks as part of termini these days, the distance between some parts of King's Cross concourse and St Pancras is probably shorter than the distance to the platforms at KX!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2012 14:22:55 GMT
Good point that one, Tomcakes.
Very similar to some airports.
The one I fly out of had 4 terminals in 4 separate buildings - which included a lot of walking to change airlines.
Just recently all was combined into one terminal - and touted as a feature - but really just downsizing and loss of flights. And this is (or was, I suppose) an "international" airport.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2012 14:31:05 GMT
Midland trains originally went to Euston (over L&B/LNWR from Rugby - a Midland/LNW amalgamation (or take over) was seriously contemplated); in the 1850s the Leicester & Hitchin line was built and Midland services started running to King's Cross over the GNR (but the LNW route remained in use). In both cases the Midland was running over a line which was both very busy, and belonging to a competitor, so it rapidly decided to build its own line into London, with its own main line passenger station (as well as goods facilities), and - importantly and from the start - a connection onto the Metropolitan Railway (Widened Lines). For 'local' services (to such far flung places as Hendon, and onto the T&H (now part of GOBLIN)) Moorgate was always the main terminal.
So unlike most of the other London termini, St Pancras was always mainly for long distance trains, without much suburban traffic.
In the late 1930s the LMSR intended to rebuild Euston, and divert Midland line trains into it.
Then in the late 1950s BR had a plan to rebuild King's Cross and St Pancras into a single, combined station (though I have never seen any details).
In the late 1960s there was a proposal to divert Midland main line services back into Euston (via Northampton or Rugby), post LNW/WCML electrification, with suburban services all going to Moorgate, permitting closure of St Pancras.
But none of these came to fruition
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and a scumbag landlord who was held up to be some sort of hero.
