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Post by edwardfox on Jul 19, 2011 19:35:16 GMT
Secret plans entailed use of the station, in the prelude to a nuclear war, to evacuate several thousand civil servants to the Central Government War Headquarters underground bunker in Wiltshire.
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castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
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Post by castlebar on Jul 20, 2011 8:32:28 GMT
I understand it was "British Museum" on the Central Line
Five reasons:
1 - to get evacuated persons to Wiltshire, it would require a westbound direction of travel
2 - Central London location
3 - Deep (= bombproof & radiation proof)
4 - Easy access from Westminster (via the Holborn tram subway which is still kept "as was")
5 - Away from the eyes of the general public - work could be done there as the political climate detiorated.
No other station seems to tick all the necessary boxes
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castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
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Post by castlebar on Jul 20, 2011 8:43:05 GMT
Oh and a sixth. > Easy loading of only those required to travel. Any 'open' station would be crowded with the general public trying to escape London. By using a 'closed' station, passenger control would be a 100 times easier. Trains would then run fast (ordinary Central Line services being suspended) to the designated disembarkation station. THAT'S more difficult to fathom, but my order of preference would be Greenford, or a station with easy access to Northolt airport as some top people would need to be flown out of the UK altogether
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Post by v52gc on Jul 20, 2011 10:03:04 GMT
Olympia?
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Post by railtechnician on Jul 20, 2011 10:43:27 GMT
I understand it was "British Museum" on the Central Line Five reasons: 1 - to get evacuated persons to Wiltshire, it would require a westbound direction of travel 2 - Central London location 3 - Deep (= bombproof & radiation proof) 4 - Easy access from Westminster (via the Holborn tram subway which is still kept "as was") 5 - Away from the eyes of the general public - work could be done there as the political climate detiorated. No other station seems to tick all the necessary boxes I don't know about that, there are definitely other possibilities with direct links to the Underground from government ministries and related organisations. However, the evacuation plan that I recall and which I believe to still be valid is to use the A10 and head north!. The route would be barred to the general public by armed forces and civilian police. Of course we really don't know, such plans are drawn and redrawn endlessly as the political landscape and world threats change and evolve. The truth is that many of the locations that the government and civil authorities would have been evacuated to were mothballed at the end of the cold war and have been run down over the last 25 years, dozens have been sold off including MOD bunkers and stores and former GPO/PO deep level communications sites and many civil defence locations. That said a government would not amount to much without keeping a few secrets and no doubt there are still plenty of those which await discovery by future generations.
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castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
Posts: 1,316
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Post by castlebar on Jul 20, 2011 16:29:05 GMT
@ railtechnician
In the original posting it said the Wiltshire bunker. There are others around Britain, but you wouldn't use the A10 to get to Wiltshire (unless you were a cabbie with the meter running)
@ v52gc
This is/was a possibility, but the problem there was the distance between Olympia from Westminster. Roads to Olympia likely to be clogged in such a situation. Also, access to an airport needed and in the 1960s, Northolt is the obvious one. Agree that once at Olympia, subject to the necessary (rail) coaching stock being in place (not logistically easy), Olympia is good, BUT my undersatnding was road coaches stored at Northolt airport to collect passengers from a designated central line station. With C. Line services otherwise suspended, l still think this was the preferred answer. The 'authorities', wouldn't want half the civil service trapped on a train somewhere 'out in the sticks' because of a sabotaged line - don't forget, there were no mobile phones in the 60s
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Post by phillw48 on Jul 20, 2011 16:40:03 GMT
Not forgetting that there is/was a secret bunker not far from Ongar. There may well be others concealed near the ends of other underground lines.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2011 16:50:36 GMT
That must be the secret bunker that's shown on road signs in the area!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2011 16:53:48 GMT
The bunker in Ongar is open to the public now AIUI. It was the London regional guv one.
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slugabed
Zu lang am schnuller.
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Post by slugabed on Jul 20, 2011 16:53:54 GMT
Not forgetting that there is/was a secret bunker not far from Ongar. There may well be others concealed near the ends of other underground lines. Now owned by a bloke who has opened it as a Cold War museum (when I was last in the vicinity). Funny to see the brown "heritage" road-signs saying "Secret Nuclear Bunker" around the Kelvedon Hatch area. Mind you,it was alwats pretty obvious with a ruddy great radio and microwave tower on top. In the very early 80s I visited a "secret" bunker at North Cheam by the LT playing fields,not that far from Morden.Ken Livingstone opened several of them up for the day when he became leader of the GLC.
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Post by trivran on Jul 20, 2011 17:01:45 GMT
It's obvious innit, it's Vauxhall Cross..
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Post by edwardfox on Jul 20, 2011 17:04:49 GMT
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Post by trivran on Jul 20, 2011 17:09:14 GMT
That's actually quite interesting. Do you know any more about this, like how they would cram 1000 civil servants onto one train? Imagine doing that with a Class 378..
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2011 17:43:16 GMT
Presumably using a long loco-hauled train (or two, or more .... ), which would head off up to North Pole and turn left on to the GW main line (a move which can't be done, now - except by going round via Willesden Junction). Then .... all possible speed, to Wiltshire!
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Post by railtechnician on Jul 20, 2011 19:33:41 GMT
@ railtechnician In the original posting it said the Wiltshire bunker. There are others around Britain, but you wouldn't use the A10 to get to Wiltshire (unless you were a cabbie with the meter running) I think you should have read my whole reply including the first line!
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Ben
fotopic... whats that?
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Post by Ben on Jul 20, 2011 19:35:01 GMT
Northolt Airport is probably still in plans for something somewhere. Its now the RAFs main London base, since the others (in West London at least) have been sold off.
North Cheam was once proposed as a location for the Northern line to extend to. In fact this was given heavy prominance by the LPTB around wartime supposedly because it had a large population and was poorly served by railways. One wonders whether such a plan lingered on into the cold war, albeit without publicity.
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castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
Posts: 1,316
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Post by castlebar on Jul 20, 2011 21:40:54 GMT
Intersting article about Olympia in wiki, and thanks for the info.
However, l got my info 30 years ago from somebody (now deceased) who spent his whole life working in the Foreign Office. I strongly suspect that the "Ministry of Organising Such Things" would prefer the flexibility of coaching people to various locations than trying to stuff 1,000 civil servants onto one train at Olympia. - a highly obvious and expensive target. In such scenarios, "All animals are equal, but some animals are more expendible than others" Trying to get that number of people to Olympia whilst the roads are crammed with millions trying to flee London isn't really practical. Dedicated Central Line trains running non-stop from British Museum to say South Ruislip, all other C. Line services being suspended, is, l suggest, more "do-able". As this still might be a current plan, it is unlikely to appear in wiki
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Post by trivran on Jul 20, 2011 22:52:49 GMT
I'd love that. "There's an ICBM! Quick, to the British Museum!" And they all jump on a central line train to Ruislip where they get on a chiltern to Birmingham where they set up the Houses of Parliament again..
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Post by edwardfox on Jul 21, 2011 3:22:23 GMT
A little morbid perhaps, but is it really true that HM The Queen's funeral has already been planned down to the last detail? Just something I read somewhere
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castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
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Post by castlebar on Jul 21, 2011 6:31:53 GMT
@ Ed Fox
Yes, it is true This is the function of the "Premier Peer of the Realm" who is the Duke of Norfolk. I am sure he has it sorted, and that for this, the Central Line and using the old British Museum station is not involved.
Like in the original question, there are loads of civil servants (allegedly) "planning" for all eventualities.
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Post by 21146 on Jul 21, 2011 11:22:00 GMT
A little morbid perhaps, but is it really true that HM The Queen's funeral has already been planned down to the last detail? Just something I read somewhere I would imagine it has been. The Queen Mother's plan was codenamed "Operation Tay Bridge" and I've heard similar phrases exist for other senior Royals.
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Post by phillw48 on Jul 21, 2011 12:38:42 GMT
Indeed, IIRC Prince Phillip has planned his own funeral.
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Post by edwardfox on Jul 21, 2011 12:58:02 GMT
Indeed, IIRC Prince Phillip has planned his own funeral. I wouldn't think there'd be any Chinese dignitaries attending
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SE13
In memoriam
RIP 23-Oct-2013
Glorious Gooner
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Post by SE13 on Jul 22, 2011 6:12:20 GMT
A little morbid perhaps, but is it really true that HM The Queen's funeral has already been planned down to the last detail? Just something I read somewhere I would imagine it has been. The Queen Mother's plan was codenamed "Operation Tay Bridge" and I've heard similar phrases exist for other senior Royals. Absolutely true. All radio and television stations have plans for what to run, when to run it, and the music to be played, and how to coincide it all between the bigger media players.
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Post by railtechnician on Jul 22, 2011 11:06:36 GMT
A little morbid perhaps, but is it really true that HM The Queen's funeral has already been planned down to the last detail? Just something I read somewhere Nothing morbid about it at all. Like it or not a funeral or similar service is just a part of normal life, personally I wouldn't waste the time, money and resources upon such an event but then I'm not a royalist. In fact I have a very succinct funeral plan written into my Will, basically it says do it as cheap as possible, don't waste any tears and have a good laugh, "I'm not dying to get into the cemetary"! But then I'm not religious and have expressed my wish to be cremated.
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