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Post by jamesb on Feb 9, 2011 10:03:45 GMT
I was at Oxford Circus yesterday, and saw somebody hold open a door of a 09 train to allow a group of passengers to board. He held a single leaf of a double set open for about 30 seconds.
When he let go, the leaf stayed where it was, half open.
It remained like that for about a minute, before the single leaf fully opened, and then closed.
Are the doors designed to do that if they are held open? What is the logic behind it? A safety feature to prevent someone getting squashed in the doors?
It is annoying but not uncommon for people to hold doors in this way, but it delayed the train by over a minute from departing... The driver seemed to do nothing but wait for the single leaf to close.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 10:56:27 GMT
The doors, being electrically driven as opposed to air, have an obstacle detect function. If high resistance to the doors being closed is detected it will reopen/close again. I think they are currently configured to do this 3 times before the door leaf stalls.
The Train Operator then has to select selective re-open, which fully opens, then closes the door again, so the operator will have taken action.
At the point of the third obstacle detect, there should be a driver message, telling the driver a door has failed to close. A PA announcement can be made if the operator can still see someone obstructing a doorway, before doing the selective re-open/close.
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Post by jamesb on Feb 9, 2011 11:37:27 GMT
So yesterday, the door probably tried 3 times to close (and all 3 times it was getting held open) and then, after a delay of about 30 seconds, the driver had to select selective re-open (to re-open just that leaf?).
Why was there a 30 second delay with the leaf half open, with nobody holding it (after it had been held for a period of time)?
Was this because the driver couldn't quite work out what was going on and then realised that he needed to selectively re-open then close it?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 11:38:52 GMT
I was at Oxford Circus yesterday, and saw somebody hold open a door of a 09 train to allow a group of passengers to board. He held a single leaf of a double set open for about 30 seconds. I hate it when I see people doing that - it's idiotic and annoying... |
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Post by jamesb on Feb 9, 2011 11:49:52 GMT
I was at Oxford Circus yesterday, and saw somebody hold open a door of a 09 train to allow a group of passengers to board. He held a single leaf of a double set open for about 30 seconds. I hate it when I see people doing that - it's idiotic and annoying... I agree - at least on the older trains, when they let go, the door slammed shut.... If the person gets cut in half its their own fault.... |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 11:55:45 GMT
I hate it when I see people doing that - it's idiotic and annoying... I agree - at least on the older trains, when they let go, the door slammed shut.... If the person gets cut in half its their own fault.... It's totally unnecessary as well - most of the time the next train is about a minute behind and more delay is caused by these people preventing the train from leaving by holding the doors open... |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 12:01:16 GMT
Was this because the driver couldn't quite work out what was going on and then realised that he needed to selectively re-open then close it? Probably. Three cycles will usually be enough to get the normal passenger who didnt realise they were obstructing the door out of the way. Then you get the idiots....... |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 13:43:06 GMT
09s have electrically operated doors versus the air operated doors we're used to. I caught this in action on video on a 96ts- when the doors are supposed to close, if they are held open, they will close the rest of the way once released.
The new doors will stall in place with the protection systems; if something is caught in the door they will hold in place. I think it needs to be 'reset' before the door can be closed on an 09, similar in a way to the sensitive edge. Not good for hold-ups!
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Post by superteacher on Feb 9, 2011 21:54:19 GMT
These sensitive edges really need to be quietly decommisioned. It amazes me that some idiot got paid for even THINKING they would work properly. Yes, it's a good idea in principle, but it will never work in practice. If they have any hope of running 30+tph on the Vic, they need to get rid of this silly door system.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2011 22:12:56 GMT
It's totally unnecessary as well - most of the time the next train is about a minute behind and more delay is caused by these people preventing the train from leaving by holding the doors open... But some people do not think like this!!! They want to get on *that* train and no other. You can point out the platform indicators and probably point out the headlights of the next train waiting to get in the platform. All you're likely to get is your head bitten off or the typical "I don't care!" attitude. And people moan at delays. Thats why there *are* delays mate, due to numbnuts holding the doors back. |
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Post by metrider on Feb 9, 2011 22:23:38 GMT
The doors, being electrically driven as opposed to air, have an obstacle detect function. If high resistance to the doors being closed is detected it will reopen/close again. I think they are currently configured to do this 3 times before the door leaf stalls. The Train Operator then has to select selective re-open, which fully opens, then closes the door again, so the operator will have taken action. At the point of the third obstacle detect, there should be a driver message, telling the driver a door has failed to close. A PA announcement can be made if the operator can still see someone obstructing a doorway, before doing the selective re-open/close. Interesting info and an engineering solution... However totally at odds with reality - once passengers realise that it's so easy to hold the doors open. Maybe id instead of giving into the resistance and stopping, the doors should gently back off a little then reasonably violently try to close again with normal force to at least the previous position achieved. They might get stopped again of the obstruction is real, but if it is a human holding the doors, then I maybe muscles could not adjust quickly enough to that door movement to resist that door movement These sensitive edges really need to be quietly decommisioned. It amazes me that some idiot got paid for even THINKING they would work properly. Yes, it's a good idea in principle, but it will never work in practice. If they have any hope of running 30+tph on the Vic, they need to get rid of this silly door system. Think of the elf and safety bods - safety system decommissioned? in these days? - never! It wouldn't be so bad if they actually did the job - but yesterday One chaps overcoat go trapped in the door and the train was able to depart. In his case not enough was protruding to catch on anything (A couple of square inches), but it was past the seal. |
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