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Post by splashdown on Oct 10, 2010 3:36:30 GMT
(4b) This forum operates a policy whereby if it's not suitable for a girl aged 13 or younger to read, it is not suitable for this forum.
Is it possible to rephrase this rule so it does not sound sexist. I would suggest using 'child' or 'person'
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Post by harlesden on Oct 10, 2010 4:13:32 GMT
I imagine girls under 13 are considered more delicate and naive than boys under 13. I think the Admin were trying to say if a post is not suitable for your 12 year old daughter to read, it does not belong on the forum.
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Colin
Advisor
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Post by Colin on Oct 10, 2010 7:03:50 GMT
Exactly - it's a phrase which is intended to be read in terms of what we consider to be morally correct.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 7:06:58 GMT
The OP does, however, have a point; furthermore, I know some girls of that age to know quite a bit more than socially expected...
Bear in mind that the phrasing is for a rule of thumb, and as Colin says, what we consider "morally correct".
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Post by londonstuff on Oct 10, 2010 9:47:25 GMT
(4b) This forum operates a policy whereby if it's not suitable for a girl aged 13 or younger to read, it is not suitable for this forum. Is it possible to rephrase this rule so it does not sound sexist. I would suggest using 'child' or 'person' Your day job isn't one where you spend it writing policies is it? A grand total of 6 posts and already trying to change the rules ;D
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 11:17:23 GMT
(4b) This forum operates a policy whereby if it's not suitable for a girl aged 13 or younger to read, it is not suitable for this forum. Is it possible to rephrase this rule so it does not sound sexist. I would suggest using 'child' or 'person' Your day job isn't one where you spend it writing policies is it? A grand total of 6 posts and already trying to change the rules ;D ;D
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Post by splashdown on Oct 10, 2010 12:11:20 GMT
So sexism is morally correct!
As girls mature quicker than boys especially around age 12, 13 then maybe a 12 year old girl would be less offended than a 12 year old boy. I understand the rule and I think it is a good one just did not seem the correct way to phrase it.
You have to give me some credit as at least I bothered to read the rules.
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Post by Dmitri on Oct 10, 2010 12:37:51 GMT
I understand the rule and I think it is a good one just did not seem the correct way to phrase it It is phrased good enough to be understood, so there is no need to change it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 12:50:43 GMT
So sexism is morally correct! As girls mature quicker than boys especially around age 12, 13 then maybe a 12 year old girl would be less offended than a 12 year old boy. I understand the rule and I think it is a good one just did not seem the correct way to phrase it. You have to give me some credit as at least I bothered to read the rules. Social norms, mate. Dmitri's right; if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Oh and good on yer, you read the rules.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 21:44:31 GMT
For what it is worth, I fully agree with splashdown.
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Oct 10, 2010 22:15:59 GMT
I'd say that the problem of 13 year old girls using language unacceptable to adults is far bigger than the potential one of any percieved sexism in the rules
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Post by railtechnician on Oct 11, 2010 2:53:32 GMT
I think this is a non-thread and really ought to be ceased, yes sexism is wrong as is bullying, racialism and oppression but there is none of that in the rule. Unfortunately we are now living in a world where nitpickers have nothing better to do than to create issues from nothing. Hopefully the new government will stamp out this variety of troublemaking which the last allowed to flourish and grow into the monster it has become and which in other ways has destroyed the many social events that we used to enjoy before its application to H&S.
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Post by splashdown on Oct 11, 2010 3:41:37 GMT
Sorry, all I was pointing out was my initial reaction to reading the rule. What this has to do with the labour government I am not sure. Sorry my opinion is not considered favourable to some.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 6:02:42 GMT
I think this is a non-thread and really ought to be ceased, yes sexism is wrong as is bullying, racialism and oppression but there is none of that in the rule. Unfortunately we are now living in a world where nitpickers have nothing better to do than to create issues from nothing. Hopefully the new government will stamp out this variety of troublemaking which the last allowed to flourish and grow into the monster it has become and which in other ways has destroyed the many social events that we used to enjoy before its application to H&S. And now I’m going to jump in. The destruction of any social events has absolutely nothing to do with H&S. It’s all down to the extortionate premiums for public liability cover and the enthusiasm with which people sue for damages when anybody gets the slightest bump or graze these days. H&S gets the blame as the idea that meddlesome bureaucrats are trying to run our lives is a lot easier to swallow than the thought that the insurance companies are taking us to the cleaners because we see every accident as a chance to cash in. Do you imagine the ConDems are going to do anything to hinder a profitable market?
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SE13
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Post by SE13 on Oct 11, 2010 6:47:58 GMT
I'll reiterate the point Colin made, it's been the rule since fairly much the day this place was created which is some 5½ years ago, and we see no need to alter it.
It's not sexist, more a guideline as to what we expect to read to safeguard the nature of this forum.
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Post by splashdown on Oct 11, 2010 8:13:31 GMT
I was going to move on but for a moderator to claim that a rule which specifically mentions girl rather than child or person as not sexist obviously has a very different view of the world than I do. It is only a small point and I did not realise it would upset the establishment so much. I am not particularly concerned about how long the rule has been around as that is not an argument for not changing it. In fact its a good argument to say it needs reviewing. What I am concerned about is the accusations that come along with making a comment. I am new to the forum yet I have already been pigeon holed as some kind of left wing do gooder who will soon be trampled on by this nice new government. You told me to read the rules and then you get upset when I question one of them. Anyway leave the rule as is because it does reflect the type of people who attend and run this forum. I'll reiterate the point Colin made, it's been the rule since fairly much the day this place was created which is some 5½ years ago, and we see no need to alter it. It's not sexist, more a guideline as to what we expect to read to safeguard the nature of this forum.
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Oracle
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Post by Oracle on Oct 11, 2010 8:23:31 GMT
I know of that Rule, and I have no objection to it. I can also understand the logic behind its wording. I add for that I was a lawyer for 20 or so years and have a daughter and two sons. The younger son is a teenager and his language is absolutely foul at times...I am amazed at what today's kids learn from amongst other sources, YouTube.
I have been and still am a Mod on an international automotive website with 40,000 members for over 11 years. I still think that the Mods and Admins do an excellent job steering through the 'minefields'. I also have to deal with matters arising like this frequently and in my personal opinion unless there is a genuine reason to change an existing rule that has stoof the test of time, leave it as it is. Objections and the reasons for them can however be noted for future reference if and when the rules are reviewed generally.
Best wishes.
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slugabed
Zu lang am schnuller.
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Post by slugabed on Oct 11, 2010 8:46:14 GMT
Splashdown,mate,the problem is that you have,perhaps inadvertantly,wandered into a debate which is much bigger than this forum,which,as a result,has been politicised,which perhaps muddies the waters. But bear in mind that: This is a forum for the discussion of transport-related topics. It's not an arm of the State. Though this may have demographic repercussions,there really are many shades of opinion here,some of which you may disagree with quite deeply. My impression over the last couple of years here though, is that,compared to other boards,the level of vituperation and abuse is miniscule,and the level of debate generally cordial. Finally,regardless of my own opinions on this issue,I cannot help thinking that,in the worldwide battle against injustice and prejudice,there are bigger targets than Rule 4b of District Dave's London Underground Site.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 9:22:20 GMT
"Finally,regardless of my own opinions on this issue,I cannot help thinking that,in the worldwide battle against injustice and prejudice,there are bigger targets than Rule 4b of District Dave's London Underground Site."
;D
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Post by railtechnician on Oct 11, 2010 9:23:44 GMT
I think this is a non-thread and really ought to be ceased, yes sexism is wrong as is bullying, racialism and oppression but there is none of that in the rule. Unfortunately we are now living in a world where nitpickers have nothing better to do than to create issues from nothing. Hopefully the new government will stamp out this variety of troublemaking which the last allowed to flourish and grow into the monster it has become and which in other ways has destroyed the many social events that we used to enjoy before its application to H&S. And now I’m going to jump in. The destruction of any social events has absolutely nothing to do with H&S. It’s all down to the extortionate premiums for public liability cover and the enthusiasm with which people sue for damages when anybody gets the slightest bump or graze these days. H&S gets the blame as the idea that meddlesome bureaucrats are trying to run our lives is a lot easier to swallow than the thought that the insurance companies are taking us to the cleaners because we see every accident as a chance to cash in. Do you imagine the ConDems are going to do anything to hinder a profitable market? I do not disagree with your point at all. The point I made was that the application of a particular point of view to social events, such as for example steam fairs, has led directly to exactly what you have described and scared the hell out of those responsible for the welfare of visitors. I agree that it is not H&S itself that is the issue but the removal of the concept of common sense and its application to human behaviour and its potential for a disastrous outcome which could cost organisers dear. Regarding the last government, the point in that regard was that it not only allowed but promoted the concept of blame at law for anything and everything including matters where individuals really should be taking personal responsibility for their own actions. The blames and claims culture has to end and I believe the present government will be making moves to stop people making a fast buck out of their own incompetence.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 9:25:48 GMT
This thread is about rule 4B, not British politics.
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Post by nickf on Oct 11, 2010 9:33:15 GMT
I am reminded of when a friend and I went into a shop. When he paid for what he had bought, my friend said: "Thanks very much love," to the girl behind the counter, and he got a mouthful of abuse for his pains. The girl was genuinely offended and he had meant nothing but politeness. It was a meeting of two incompatible thought processes and I wonder if this is what happening here. The OP genuinely feels that there is a need to review the wording of rule 4b, other members feel definitely no need and identify the request as a symptom of something they dislike. Perhaps in a case like this the status quo should prevail unless there is a significant majority thinking otherwise. Amended to correct spelling.
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Post by phillw48 on Oct 11, 2010 9:36:25 GMT
This thread is about rule 4B, not British politics. I agree entirely with the above. I think members should refrain from making political references unless it is relevant to the thread such as published party policy regarding the London underground system.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 9:45:36 GMT
I am reminded of when a friend and I went into a shop. When he paid for what he had bought, my friend said: "Thanks very much love," to the girl behind the counter, and he got a mouthful of abuse for his pains. The girl was genuinely offended and he had meant nothing but politeness. It was a meeting of two incompatible thought processes and I wonder if this is what happening here. The OP genuinely feels that there is a need to review the wording of rule 4b, other members feel definitely no need and identify the request as a symptom of something they dislike. Perhaps in a case like this the status quo should prevail unless there is a significant majority thinking otherwise. Amended to correct spelling. Correct.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 9:46:27 GMT
This thread is about rule 4B, not British politics. I agree entirely with the above. I think members should refrain from making political references unless it is relevant to the thread such as published party policy regarding the London underground system. Thank you for your support ;D
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Post by setttt on Oct 11, 2010 10:17:40 GMT
On the subject of forum rules, I think this thread has demonstrated a need for two more; one which bans top-posting, and one which bans pointless one word/smiley posts for the sake of boosting one's post count.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 11:03:29 GMT
I have to say, that rule made me roll my eyes a bit. Perhaps it should be rephrased as referring to language you'd be happy for a 12 year old 'child' to read.
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slugabed
Zu lang am schnuller.
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Post by slugabed on Oct 11, 2010 11:24:08 GMT
Pardon my ignorance,but what is "Top-posting"?
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Oct 11, 2010 12:53:08 GMT
Pardon my ignorance,but what is "Top-posting"? Top-posting is where the reply is above the quoted text. This Forum generally runs on bottom-posting, where the reply is below the quoted text. Moderator Comment: rest assured that the Forum Staff are watching this thread.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 13:36:11 GMT
On the subject of forum rules, I think this thread has demonstrated a need for two more; one which bans top-posting, and one which bans pointless one word/smiley posts for the sake of boosting one's post count. I think you mean me, about the short posts. Am I right?
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