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Post by happybunny on May 25, 2009 13:12:12 GMT
It still amazes me how LUL claim everything is running fine, when a branch of the line is only running a 50% service.
The Edgware Rd - Wimbledon service is running every 20 minutes, instead of every 10, due to H&C alterations.
So someone wanting this service checks the TfL website before they leave home, notices good service and nothing mentioned about a 50% frequency on this branch, only to find they have a 20 minute wait for there train.
World class service ? ?
They don't even have any timetables on display at the stations involved, and of course the announcements still droning on "We have a good service on the District line blah blah"
It is the same when there has been engineering work on part of the line and the Ealing has seen its service reduced to every 20 minutes, and only High St shuttles.. you hear "Due to engineering work there is no service between Embankment and Barking, a good service on the rest of the line" or whatever, but they don't give any information to people who are affected by the severe reduction in trains at there local station!
When the service is going to be anything less than ten min frequency, they need to have leaflets and posters available at the stations affected INCLUDING a timetable of services for the affected days, and also have the same information available on the website. Anything less than a 10 minute frequency is NOT a metro style turn-up-and-go... and needs a timetable available.
I know the journey planner reflects the alterations but is only available to people with a computer!
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Phil
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Post by Phil on May 25, 2009 15:57:45 GMT
The cynic in me says that the Wimbleware branch is not REALLY officially considered part of the District by TfL, so "It doesn't count"! Or, worse perhaps, if the rest of the District is unaffected, the total delays may be less than 10% so hence " There is a good service on the District line" Either way, not a lot of help to customers passengers  |
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2009 18:37:15 GMT
A "good service" is in operation if the interval between trains is roughly the timetabled interval.
(It does not matter if the actual trains in position are not those that should be there, the customer doesn't care if the correct set number is there. Equally whilst is should perhaps state "special timetable in operation" somewhere, that isn't one of the accepted descriptors for the state of the service board. Since the interval is that timetabled for the day "good service" is correctly stated.) I feel it was be equally inappropriate for "minor delays" to be posted as the descripton when the service is running to book. It would give an inappropriate bad impression. In my experience the departure times are generally posted on the board at Ealing Bdy when a 20min service is operating. The Wimbledon service is not sufficiently reduced or infrequent to warrent timings I'd say.
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Post by Dmitri on May 25, 2009 19:02:45 GMT
Since the interval is that timetabled for the day "good service" is correctly stated.) I feel it was be equally inappropriate for "minor delays" to be posted as the descripton when the service is running to book. It would give an inappropriate bad impression. We have 'increased intervals' type of announcement - I think it is more appropriate here. |
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Post by Chris M on May 25, 2009 19:08:12 GMT
Perhaps then descriptors such as "reduced service" (instead of "good service"). "reduced service with minor delays", "reduced service with severe delays", etc should be introduced. When a line is offering a noticeably reduced service (4tph or fewer perhaps, certainly 3tph or fewer), it would be very useful to display a poster, info-board or whatever with a prominent message like Reduced service due to engineering works - trains at approximately these minutes past each hour
| Eastbound | Westbound | | 05 | 12 | | 25 | 32 | | 45 | 52 |
And have it displayed for a few days prior as well so that passengers can plan ahead. Another thing that I find frustrating is that when a line is part suspended, the info boards just show "part suspended" and give you no indication of how the service on the operational part of the line is running. For example if the Central Line is suspended Liverpool Street - Leytonstone, it would be nice to know whether my Oxford Circus - Bank journey will likely be delayed or not. |
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2009 22:22:36 GMT
I suspect that in LUL's eyes it's still a good service even if few or no through trains are operating - e.g. if the Wimblewares were all curtailed to High St for some reason, so long as the Circle was running anything like normally it would still be "good".
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2009 0:42:07 GMT
I think tfl get the right to define what they consider a 'good' service as they create the parameters. It's better to make PAs than put timetables up. One example is Acton Town where they will say 'the next District is 15mins away it will be quicker to take this Piccadilly line train and change'.
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2009 9:58:53 GMT
The terminology TfL use is explained on their website.
A Good service does not mean that a train will run every 5 seconds and will turn up the minute you step foot on the platform. A Good service doesn't claim you won't have a longer wait for your journey.
To quote TfL:
Good service:
No noticeable impact on your journey
Minor delays:
Noticeably longer journey time however, stay with your planned route
Severe delays:
Significantly longer journey time - consider using another route
Suspended / Part suspended:
Your planned route is unavailable - please use another route or mode of transport
Part closure / Planned closure:
Planned engineering works on part or all of a line - please use another route or mode of transport
What really amazes me HB, is why the District needed to opearte a reduced service in the first place.
I could be wrong, but the platform usage at Edgware Road was similar to what will happen when the T-cup comes in.
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Phil
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Post by Phil on May 28, 2009 10:19:43 GMT
What really amazes me HB, is why the District needed to opearte a reduced service in the first place. I could be wrong, but the platform usage at Edgware Road was similar to what will happen when the T-cup comes in. Could have been a useful experiment for the future then....... |
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Post by Chris M on May 28, 2009 10:30:18 GMT
What really amazes me HB, is why the District needed to opearte a reduced service in the first place. I could be wrong, but the platform usage at Edgware Road was similar to what will happen when the T-cup comes in. Could have been a useful experiment for the future then....... Ah, but if it hadn't worked then there would have been a need for someone to admit they were wrong.... |
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Post by happybunny on May 29, 2009 7:00:22 GMT
I believe there is going to be a T Cup trial one weekend in June... lets wait and see what happens  |
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Colin
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Post by Colin on May 29, 2009 8:28:57 GMT
What really amazes me HB, is why the District needed to opearte a reduced service in the first place. The reason was that there was track replacement work on the H&C's Hammersmith to Edgware Road section - as a result less C stocks were available on account of Hammersmith depot being cut off, and because the Circle line & D stock service to Wimbledon offer alternatives, it's best to take trains away from the Wimbleware service to use elsewhere. |
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Post by happybunny on May 29, 2009 9:01:09 GMT
But throughout that weekend, unless I am mistaken, there were 3 spare C Stocks in Triangle sidings, all weekend.
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Colin
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Post by Colin on May 29, 2009 9:24:59 GMT
I can't say I paid much attention TBH, but the WTT says you are mistaken!  On the Saturday & Monday, 3 trains were scheduled from Triangle, leaving 2 spares, and on the Sunday, 4 were scheduled leaving just the 1 spare. Based on those figures, there were not enough c stocks available for a full Wimbleware service. |
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Post by ajamieson on May 29, 2009 14:00:42 GMT
Well a big 'raspberry' to the station staff at Tower Hill at about 8pm last night who kept repeating that the platform describers were not working and the next train to xxx would be along in a couple of minutes. At first glance this made sense as the describers showed five successive District trains to Upminster, all 'held', followed by a Circle line 14 minutes away - surely an error.
Problem is, the platform describers were working perfectly and it was the service itself that was stuffed. Circle was suspended clockwise, screwed up anti-clockwise and there were obvious knock-on delays to the District including our sudden termination (we had been on the way to Upminster). So the platform describer turned out to be completely accurate. Needless to say this total chaos, complete with yawning service gaps on the Circle, was cheerfully described throughout as a "good" service.
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Post by uzairjubilee on May 29, 2009 22:29:50 GMT
I'm sure there were 2 in the Triangle Sidings when I went to HSK
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