Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Jun 27, 2008 22:51:20 GMT
It wasn't really until the JLE stations that step-free access became a priority in designs. Prior to that it would be added if it wasn't too difficult/expensive but wasn't really that important. Older stations that have step-free access have it more as an accident than by design - think of the stations where there are lifts from the surface to nearly platform level but just one or two steps remain to be negotiated.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2008 7:52:07 GMT
I'm a little late to this thread, but the plan was to close the old station at end of traffic on Friday night, and to reopen with the new northbound platform and ticket hall on Sunday afternoon. It didn't all go quite to plan!
Old station closed as scheduled, the northbound track was slewed at both junctions to the new tunnels (step-plate junctions had been constructed already) and the first train ran through on the new northbound alignment at around 6pm on Sunday. I was on it, and have never seen so much arcing from the new track in my life! Southbound trains continued to run, just non-stopping Angel for some weeks while the cross-passages were knocked through to the new central concourse.
However, although the new platform had trains there were no passengers at the station, because the new (French) escalators weren't working properly. The station briefly opened the following day and then closed again for a few weeks until the escalators were reliable enough. The Evening Standard had a field day with the story on the front page :-)
The station wasn't closed for a year though, as mentioned up-thread - that may have been how long it took to finish the refurbishment of the old island platform with new cladding perhaps.
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Post by railtechnician on Jun 30, 2008 8:16:04 GMT
wow, just look where that man/woman (cant really tell) is standing, not that it makes differents these day because people seem to thing walking on the white line will get them on train faster Actually at a lot of the time, walking along the white line is the only way to get on a train - the platform is so full that this the only way to move further along the platform to an area where you stand a chance of getting on the train. Tottenham Court Road and Liverpool Street (Central Line) spring to mind as examples. So true, indeed back in the 70s when Liverpool St Met still had three platforms and I worked out of Whitechapel depot I would regularly have to walk the white line in the rush hour to get to a less crowded part of the platform. I think that people were far more disciplined years ago than they are today. Also we live in a blame culture, H&S has gone too far in some respects to such an extent that some people expect to be looked after no matter how reckless or stupid their actions may be. It is not necessarily true that there are more passengers at any given time of day but it is true that there are more irresponsible ones. As for falling off the platform it can happen at any time to those who aren't taking care of themselves!
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Post by edwin on Jul 1, 2008 1:20:19 GMT
It wasn't really until the JLE stations that step-free access became a priority in designs. Prior to that it would be added if it wasn't too difficult/expensive but wasn't really that important. Older stations that have step-free access have it more as an accident than by design - think of the stations where there are lifts from the surface to nearly platform level but just one or two steps remain to be negotiated. Yes that's probably the reason, but didn't they have any foresight whatsoever? Maybe i'm being to optimistic here Could they ever re-open the old lift shafts, with new lifts and the old entrance to give Angel step-free access?
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Post by abe on Jul 1, 2008 8:01:43 GMT
Probably not, because the lift shafts don't come down in the right place. As I remember, there was a curved passageway from the lower lift landing to the stairs that led down onto the platforms. Even if the shafts were deepened, they would not come out between the platforms. Unless completely new shafts were sunk, one possibility would be to add a short lift shaft from platform level to the level of the old lower lift landing, and connect them with a new passageway - a bit like the current plans for Archway.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2008 10:15:34 GMT
You remember the layout correct. All the old passageways and lift shafts are still in place, just hidden away and getting rather musty. If you look at the western (back) end of the southbound platform at Angel, you'll see a door. There's a fixed ladder that leads up to where the top of the old staircase was at the end of the passage from the lower lift landing.
If Chelsea-Hackney: a) is ever built b) runs via Angel then the escalator access will be using the current top (long) bank of escalators, with new linking passages and more escalators from the mid-level landing to new platforms below the Northern line.
Having Google Earthed the juxtaposition between the old (lifts) and new (escalator) ticket halls, I think it possible to run a subway from the new ticket hall, descending (by lift or ramp) to run under the office development (built at the same time as the new ticket hall), in a subway under Torrens Street, to the site of the old ticket hall. Such a subway would be 50m long, so perfectly reasonable and around the same as many JLE lift accesses, although might require relocation of some services from the basement of the office development.
You would then lower the top landing of one of the lift shafts by around 15' and stick in an MIP lift. From the old lower lift landing it would be trivially simple to refurbish the old passageway to the platform, and put in a lift with 20' vertical rise to bring you out on the southbound Northern line platform. For Chelsea-Hackney you just bore a short new passageway from the lower landing to a lift to go down to that level.
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Post by cetacean on Jul 1, 2008 11:06:58 GMT
There's a big difference in height between the two ticket halls - Torrens Street is one if not two storeys below the new ticket hall's floor level. Getting underneath it would be quite some undertaking. I think the best bet would be to follow your plan but skip using the old lift shaft, just going straight down somewhere beneath Angel Square (probably within the courtyard).
I believe that Chelney safeguarding incldues new surface buildings somewhere on the west side of Upper Street, so lifts from there is also an option, although they'd be a long way form the Northern Line platforms.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2008 11:15:03 GMT
You're right about the difference in levels - delete the words "ramp or" from my post above and keep the word "lift" to avoid runaway pushchairs or wheelchairs ;D
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