Quite possibly the worst TfL service!

I made a return journey between Debden and Hackney Central on Saturday evening.
On the outward journey I just missed a train at Stratford and thus had to wait about 10 minutes for a train (70% of the seats in the carriage I was in filled immediately) and then another 10 minutes for the train to move, by which time it was standing room only - 6pm Saturday is hardly peak time.

The journey to Hackney was quite uneventful and we got there and discharged a lot of passengers - the narrow footbridge meant it took a while to exit the station. A couple of people were complaining that they had to pay now, presumably the gates are new and they could fare-dodge previously?

On the way back at about 10pm the train was 1 minute late (although the DMI is difficult to read as it keeps flashing between due time and expected time) and there were only a handful of seats available. The seats feel narrow and the gangway is so narrow that getting to them isn't easy. How on earth people are meant to move in the rush hour is beyond me.

The journey to Stratford did feel very slow, especially compared to the Central Line.

The line needs more and longer trains, as well as speed increases if possible.

I think that people are expecting too much, too quickly from London Overground. Most of the changes so far have been do to with the stations, but as far as the trains and infrastructure, little has changed since the take over from Silverlink. There have been some minor timetable changes, but we will have to wait a littlw while yet before the service becomes anything like TFL standard. And of course, people now resent paying for such a poor service!
Perhaps all those who regularly run down their local tube station should be forced to travel on the North London Line - a sobering experience indeed!

If you think its bad for the passenger, you should try being a member of staff, someone like me who has nothing but abuse virtually on a day to day basis since i started on the NLL in 1993.

Today is a prime example Train is due to leave Clapham Junction at 07.05, train leaves at 07.05 and what do i get two passengers sticking their fingers up at me and calling me all the you know whats in the world and why? because the train left at its scheduled time and thay were the ones who were late.

The main reason with overcrowding is mostly down to lack of common sense and indeed most of the late running in the peak periods is down to PASSENGER loading. It seems like the hotelinspector has never used the NLL in the rush hour. Drivers dont make announcements in the first place. PAX MOANING AND SHOUTING like its the traincrews fault. Perhaps the hotelinspector would like to work with me for a week and see if he gets a better idea of the NLL and all its inherent problems. He might be a bit more forgiving in the future.

Just ruin his day if he isnt happy with the service use the 276 bus next time........ might be quicker.

With regard to waiting at Stratford unless you was traveling late at night you would not wait 10 minutes on the platform and then another 10 on the train, as the train service is every 15 minutes until around 19.30. Then it goes every 20 minutes then if what you are saying is true trains leave extremley EARLY.
Keithy

I've only been on the North London Railway briefly in the rush hours. Yes it was busy (most lines are)! The 3+2 layout on the trains does make it difficult but it's not the trains fault! The 313s do a good job on the GN & City! If the trains where operating on the route another 10 years they could think about changing the seating to benches if possible. New trains and improvements are needed but as keithy said this isn't going to happen over night.
A real metro service is needed for this line. IMO, the Bakerloo extension needs to go ahead simply to allow the DC allocation of trains to be used on the Richmond/Stratford service. They should all be 4 cars too!

I read somewhere the other day that TfL and the local authorities involved want to electrify the GOBLIN, but Network Rail (who own the infrastructure and thus have the final say) do not see it as a priority.

Another thing that would help would be to build/move some stations so the NLL/GOBLIN actually had interchanges with the Central (Central Line platforms where it goes under the GOBLIN just east of Letyonstone High Road shouldn't be too difficult), Piccadilly and Northern Lines.

Leytonstone tube station is already walking distance from the GOBLIN station, so if they build entrances facing the right way you can get most of the benefit for very little cost. There's talk of a new station at Tuffnell Park to get to the Northern, but it doesn't seem to be an active project. I'm not sure there's much point in a Piccadilly interchange, since you can just get the Victoria at Finsbury Park which serves many of the same areas.

In five years of regularly using the NLL and GOBLIN under Silverlink, I saw on-train RPIs once.

THC

Gunnersbury would have had that interchange with the District and Piccadilly near Acton Town if LB Hounslow had been bullish enough to enforce a s106 agreement with the developers of the Chiswick Park development.

THC

Warren St/Euston Sq? Northwick Pk ain't that close to Kenton-mind you I am lazy!

Well i am glad that some of my comments have made this a more diverse topic in regards of the NLL and its inherent problems.

It wasnt meant to point accusing fingers so im sorry if that is how it appeared. I am glad that these types of discussions are raised as we here so much of what the life of a passenger is on our railway network, what we dont get as much is from the railway staff themselves. I like contributing on few railway forums, as it gives the staffs perspective on issues.

As Somerset Chris has said there is much investment going into the NLL, at the present time a lot of painting and station upgrades are taking priorty at the moment, however that doesnt mean that nothing is being done to the service, From the December timetable change earlier and later trains on both the WLL and the GOBLIN during the week and the weekend has hopefully allow passengers to start a lot earlier and finish a lot later. Also you will (hopefully) have noticed that the trains are more cleaner and that graffiti is quickly removed. Hopefully the additional staff has created a more friindlier enviroment for all concerned.

On some of the other issues on the New trains (of which the first one appears later this year) will initially be a 3 car train, however in time for the Olympics and platform extensions these will increase to a 4 car formation.
On Electrification of the GOBLIN as has been mentioned elsewhere this is going to be quite expensive and there are a few problems with OHL namely the A1 Holloway Road where you would have to close the road and raise the bridge, or drop the track level and reduce the height of the platform. The first one would be out of the question as this is one of Londons main roads.

With regard connections with other lines, some stations do go near or are a short walk away, Camden Road for Camden Town Northern, or Cally road for Cally road Piccadilly are a couple that spring to mind. Perhaps TfL might even show those connections with the walking distances. On the WLL line a new connection with the central has been made however we wont go into the farce that is Shepherds Bush Better use could be made of Hackney central to Hackney Downs connections better signage and distance could help here.

On the issue of travelling on the Goblin and not being ticket checked, all i will say is that you are a lucky man, Guards traditionally done fares on this line, however since the now not so new ADVANTIX ticket machines came out the collection of revenue has been a lot lower and that is because of the machines being unreliable and often not working. The Goblin line will become a PF area form Monday and so collection of revenue by the guard will finish.

I almost forgot New trains are also planned for the Gospel Oak / Barking line.

Like Somerset chris the different permitations to services covering all parts of London would really need another thread. One thing that TfL are doing along with NR, Freightliner, EWS and DRS is to try and get a decent cross country Electrified line for Freight trains in order to reduce the number of freight trains and so avoid London altogether. The lines between Willesden and Stratford are one of the most congested in the country.

Well i will leave their for now as i have rambled on for far to long now.


keithy

As a guard on the NLL you know better than we do and your ramblings are the truth. One thing I did like though in your ramblings was the sentence "Hopefully the additional staff has created a more friindlier enviroment for all concerned". If the staff are thinking friendlier, they will be friendlier to the passenger. the passenger will then be happier and the NLL will get a better reputation. A win win situation.

I could commute that way, but it's not worth it. It may not be terribly far, but it's uphill (going towards Archway) along a busy narrow pavement with various junctions to cross. It's not the kind of thing you want to do in the middle of your journey. If there was no alternative I wouldn't complain, but in that part of the world there are plenty.

Exactly my point.

I could be wrong, but I believe that new installations of third rail are prohibited by the HSE or some other elfin safety body. Extensions to existing systems are allowed however.

I'm not very familiar with Barking, and have never been to Gospel Oak, but from air photos it looks like the electrification at each end is by OHLE. If my understanding is correct therefore (and it might not be) 3rd rail would have to be extended to one or both of the termini before it could be applied to the GOBLIN. Whether the powers that be would accept this I have my doubts.