towerman
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Post by towerman on Dec 28, 2022 10:22:31 GMT
Posts moved from this thread - Tom.Someone must maintain safe walkways to stabled trains in depots and sidings also. At SMD it was Althsom’s responsibility to clear walkways.
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Post by 100andthirty on Dec 28, 2022 17:36:56 GMT
At SMD it was Althsom’s responsibility to clear walkways. Do you mean Golders Green and Morden? Alstom were never responsible for maintenance at Stratford Market depot.
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towerman
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Post by towerman on Dec 28, 2022 18:04:27 GMT
Oh yes they were think when the PPP collapsed Northern Line staff stayed with Alston Jubilee were taken over by TfL.Us tower staff still referred to them as Alston.
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Post by 100andthirty on Dec 29, 2022 8:48:42 GMT
Way off topic and pedantic, but:
Northern line: Staff from LU transferred to The then GEC Alsthom (now Alstom) about 6 months after the 1995 tube stock contract between LU and GEC Alstom was signed. When the Tube Lines PPP contract started, the contract was transferred to Tube Lines. When the PPP ended, the contract was transferred back to LU. The staff remained employees of Alstom thoughout.
Jubilee line: on delivery, LU was responsible for maintianing the 1996 tube stock with 'technical support' from Alstom. When the Tube Lines contract started, the staff were transferred from LU to Tube Lines. At some time during the PPP contract Tube lines took technical support in house. At the ond of the PPP, the staff were transferred back to LU.
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towerman
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Post by towerman on Dec 29, 2022 10:14:20 GMT
The fleet maintenance staff at SMD always told us they were Alstom couple of them transferred from Golders Green as they lived in East London.
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Post by 100andthirty on Dec 30, 2022 8:00:52 GMT
The fleet maintenance staff at SMD always told us they were Alstom couple of them transferred from Golders Green as they lived in East London. I clearly need to revisit my records to check what may be a dodgy memory.
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Post by d7666 on Dec 30, 2022 8:42:32 GMT
The fleet maintenance staff at SMD always told us they were Alstom couple of them transferred from Golders Green as they lived in East London. I clearly need to revisit my records to check what may be a dodgy memory. When I did SMD depot "Area A " access which was in Tube Lines era, SMD was very much Alstom depot with Alstom staff. I got trained by an Alstom fleet person and issued with an Alstom certificate. When I went again to look around a TBTC fitted unit when they were first done it was an Alstom ATM equivalent leading that.
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Post by 100andthirty on Dec 30, 2022 13:29:26 GMT
Looks like my memory was, indeed, dodgy. I'll edit an upstream post when I can find out when the work was brought in house.
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Post by t697 on Dec 30, 2022 16:57:29 GMT
Looks like my memory was, indeed, dodgy. I'll edit an upstream post when I can find out when the work was brought in house. You might recall that although LUL bought the Jubilee 96TS, maintenance of them went out to separate tender and Alstom won it. Unfortunately I forget the contract duration which is the point at issue here. On the renewal, it was brought back in house, which may prompt someone to recall the relevant date. Perhaps the thread drift into 96TS maintenance arrangements should be moved!
Done! - Tom
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towerman
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Post by towerman on Dec 30, 2022 18:02:59 GMT
I retired in early 2010,think PPP finished a year or two before that.
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Post by jimbo on Dec 30, 2022 20:01:13 GMT
I think TubeLines, appointed 2003, contracted for maintenance on the Jubilee to match the Northern arrangements. In 2010 Tube Lines became part of TfL. Maintenance was transferred back in-house to aid introduction of the new signalling system in 2011, it was said. The Northern Line fleet was leased from delivery which included maintenance, and the contract has been renewed from time to time. It has a special mention in the Government funding arrangements at each renewal. each time those are renewed, at least since Covid.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Dec 30, 2022 21:13:37 GMT
In 2010 Tube Lines became part of TfL. Maintenance was transferred back in-house to aid introduction of the new signalling system in 2011, it was said. It's an interesting perspective but even after the Tube Lines contract ended in 2010 it still remained very much a separate organisation despite being part of TfL, unlike, for example, the former Metronet companies. The former Tube Lines was initially known as Asset Performance JNP (most often referred to as AP JNP) and Amey were still involved until around 2016/17 (possibly even later). For those of us who were brought back into LU from the Former Metronet (FMR) companies it was still very much a 'them and us' existence. I've seen paperwork from AP JNP that still referred to Metronet, despite the fact FMR was an inclusive part of LU. There was also a push for AP JNP people to do work on FMR assets, but there were some people in AP JNP who were very protective of 'their railway' that it only worked in one direction and FMR staff were very much persona non grata on AP JNP territory - as I found out when trying to deliver projects which interfaced with Earl's Court control room. Similarly, if I'd had a pound for the number of times I've heard "on Tubelines we did..." followed by a description of something that didn't meet the requirements of the standards we were all supposed to have been working to, I could have retired early! There was little attempt to alter the situation and properly integrate until the last big 'Transformation' reshuffle in 2018 (once Amey were off the scene), and some would say it's still never been satisfactorily integrated as even now the 'them and us' culture still exists and there are still different salary frameworks for the same roles. In some parts of the organisation it sometimes feels like a minority takeover took place, rather than a merger and integration. One can only enivsage how things would have been if the PPP contracts had run for their full 30 years and then been re-integrated into LU!
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Post by d7666 on Dec 30, 2022 23:01:39 GMT
......... until the last big 'Transformation' "Transmogrification" reshuffle in 2018 ................
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Post by 100andthirty on Jan 1, 2023 16:49:43 GMT
Looks like my memory was, indeed, dodgy. I'll edit an upstream post when I can find out when the work was brought in house. You might recall that although LUL bought the Jubilee 96TS, maintenance of them went out to separate tender and Alstom won it. Unfortunately I forget the contract duration which is the point at issue here. On the renewal, it was brought back in house, which may prompt someone to recall the relevant date. Perhaps the thread drift into 96TS maintenance arrangements should be moved!
Done! - TomFirstly, apologies for my defective memory. As t697 has reminded us, the 1996 tube stock was maintained by Alstom, from its delivery and through the PPP. After PPP ended and at the time a contract review was required it was decided to bring the work in house with the Alstom staff TUPE'd into LU. Having double checked, this happened in 2011.
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