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Post by spsmiler on Dec 6, 2018 2:30:55 GMT
Suddenly, after many years, the iconic and historic Network SouthEast branding has been removed from the Northern City Line platforms. My tweets below show more. Simon |
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Post by melikepie on Dec 6, 2018 7:01:17 GMT
The same will probably happen to the other Northern City Line stations.
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Post by superteacher on Dec 6, 2018 7:33:04 GMT
I actually preferred the decor they had prior to NSE.
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Post by brigham on Dec 6, 2018 8:31:04 GMT
I actually preferred the decor they had prior to NSE. You mean the 'Historic' one? |
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Post by superteacher on Dec 6, 2018 9:08:21 GMT
I actually preferred the decor they had prior to NSE. You mean the 'Historic' one? See the video below: |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Dec 6, 2018 10:26:25 GMT
You mean the 'Historic' one? See the video below: Filmed 30th November 1984, it would seem (see about 30 seconds in). The signage would have been about nine years old at the time (takeover by BR in 1975) and would be replaced by NSE décor two or three years later. |
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Post by superteacher on Dec 6, 2018 10:51:30 GMT
Filmed 30th November 1984, it would seem (see about 30 seconds in). The signage would have been about nine years old at the time (takeover by BR in 1975) and would be replaced by NSE décor two or three years later. I seem to recall it was 1988 when the NSE style came in. Old Street definitely had the BR decor in 1987. |
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Post by goldenarrow on Dec 6, 2018 17:02:07 GMT
What's the point behind this superficial touch up?
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Post by spsmiler on Dec 6, 2018 17:45:05 GMT
Filmed 30th November 1984, it would seem (see about 30 seconds in). The signage would have been about nine years old at the time (takeover by BR in 1975) and would be replaced by NSE décor two or three years later. Near the end we also briefly see part of a train - Class 313, I presume, in BR blue grey livery!
btw, The only positive thing I can say about the new station name frieze is that its functional.
I find the older NSE frieze to have been more attractive (visually). A nicer font, more colourful, even some transport operator branding!
I wonder what is the fate of the old signage - dumped? for sale? donated to a transport museum?
It would be a shame to see it dumped, especially when there will people people who would 'show the love' with hard earned cash. After all, if the London Transport Museum can make money selling former train parts (luggage racks, passenger door buttons, etc) and even BR sold off things at its Collectors Corner shop near Euston station, so the same should be possible with this iconic, historic and authentic Network SouthEast signage.
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Post by toby on Dec 6, 2018 21:10:22 GMT
What's the point behind this superficial touch up? To make it look good for a PR launch of the new trains. Like Theobalds Grove was the one for the Overground expansion. |
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Post by AndrewPSSP on Dec 7, 2018 16:48:52 GMT
I don't really see the point of just putting what I presume is a vinyl sticker over the existing NSE signage. I understand that it's "good" PR that they've supposedly refreshed the look of the station but this is a much loved part of the Northern City line, and one of its most distinctive features. I personally quite liked the signage and IMO it still serves its purpose. None of it was damaged so why replace it? I'm going to take a wild guess and say the new signage is in Helvetica rather than Rail Alphabet  |
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Post by spsmiler on Dec 7, 2018 17:25:11 GMT
The whole of the NCL seems to be undergoing this change.
See here...
Simon
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Post by spsmiler on Dec 7, 2018 17:27:41 GMT
I don't really see the point of just putting what I presume is a vinyl sticker over the existing NSE signage. I understand that it's "good" PR that they've supposedly refreshed the look of the station but this is a much loved part of the Northern City line, and one of its most distinctive features. I personally quite liked the signage and IMO it still serves its purpose. None of it was damaged so why replace it? I'm going to take a wild guess and say the new signage is in Helvetica rather than Rail Alphabet Is it a vinyl sticker?
I never considered that possibility.
Simon
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Dec 7, 2018 17:45:40 GMT
Vinyl stickers are relatively cheap and much quicker (and probably easier) to install than full signage. The lack of almost any waste to process will reduce the cost as well.
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Post by AndrewPSSP on Dec 7, 2018 20:34:49 GMT
I hope it is; once the press has stopped caring about the new trains GN can (hopefully) strip them to show the NSE signage. |
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Post by spsmiler on Dec 8, 2018 14:40:58 GMT
I've just been trawling through my historic footage... it seems that there was also Network SouthEast branding with the station name on the tunnel wall on the far side of the tracks, presumably placed where it can be read by seated passengers from inside the train it is when calling at a station.
Video footage showing this will come soon!
Simon
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Post by AndrewPSSP on Dec 8, 2018 15:23:15 GMT
It seems that there was also Network SouthEast branding with the station name on the tunnel wall on the far side of the tracks   Images from the northbound and southbound platforms at Essex Road, this was the last station to have them. The other stations had First line diagrams. |
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Post by spsmiler on Dec 11, 2018 1:31:27 GMT
Andrew, thanks for those images as you actually filmed more than me - I only filmed the station name and the larger route map.
Also seen is the tiling scheme from days before the present tiles.
As seen in my film, below.
Simon
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Post by bearbin on Dec 11, 2018 19:01:44 GMT
I took a trip on the NCL yesterday and the new signage at H&I was in a woeful state - caked in dust looking like it hadn't been cleaned in forever. Most likely the cleaning schedule is not quite regular enough to keep them shiny, but perhaps the new vinyl covering has a greater static attraction to dust then the old enamel signs?
The old signs on the track-side wall are also still present at Essex Road.
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Post by brigham on Dec 12, 2018 14:44:57 GMT
What is the historical significance of Network SouthEast?
It was some sort of quango in the dying days of BR, wasn't it? Invented by ad-men as some sort of 'image-booster'?
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Dec 12, 2018 18:10:18 GMT
Not a QUANGO, but a brand in the same way as Intercity, and a pretty strong one at that.
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Post by goldenarrow on Dec 12, 2018 18:20:54 GMT
What is the historical significance of Network SouthEast? It was some sort of quango in the dying days of BR, wasn't it? Invented by ad-men as some sort of 'image-booster'? That’s one interpretation. Alternatively it was the era that saw a range of upgrades to many dilapidated or run down stations and routes that by the end of NSE where ripe for privatisation. Much of the commuter rolling stock introduced under the NSE era still form the backbone of many commuter lines in South East England. The fact that NSE managed turn around so many routes at a time when the attitude towards rail travel was sceptical (not too dissimilar to today) and inadvertently created a design icon is still something of an achievement. |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Dec 12, 2018 20:33:12 GMT
Much of the commuter rolling stock introduced under the NSE era still form the backbone of many commuter lines in South East England. Specifically the Networkers on Great Western, Chiltern, Great Northern and South Eastern, (classes 165, 166, 365, 465, 466), the class 159s on the Waterloo-Exeter line, class 319 on Thameslink (launched during the NSE era), class 321 (originally on London Midland and Great Eastern) and class 322 on Stansted Express (another service launched under NSE). Oh, and new rolling stock for the Waterloo & City Line of course. All in just eight years (1986-1994). The Network Card and Gold Card were also initiatives from that era. |
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Post by superteacher on Dec 14, 2018 8:47:33 GMT
Just platform 9 at Moorgate left now, with a few opposite the northbound platform st Essex Road (part of the old line diagram I think).
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Post by vinnielo on Dec 14, 2018 10:30:34 GMT
Is the line diagram at Moorgate still missing Welham Green and spelling the preceding station as "Brookman's[sic] Park"?
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Post by jukes on Dec 14, 2018 18:59:08 GMT
Is the line diagram at Moorgate still missing Welham Green and spelling the preceding station as "Brookman's[sic] Park"? Line diagram Maps etc at Moorgate, Old Street and Highbury in the TfL parts of the stations is, well, TfLs responsibility to update! |
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Post by goldenarrow on May 4, 2019 20:20:19 GMT
I don't really see the point of just putting what I presume is a vinyl sticker over the existing NSE signage. I understand that it's "good" PR that they've supposedly refreshed the look of the station but this is a much loved part of the Northern City line, and one of its most distinctive features. I personally quite liked the signage and IMO it still serves its purpose. None of it was damaged so why replace it? I'm going to take a wild guess and say the new signage is in Helvetica rather than Rail Alphabet Is it a vinyl sticker?
I never considered that possibility.
Simon
It is indeed, confirmed by the third photo in this Tweet catching the act (of vandalism to some). I'd guessed that they were just stuck over since they retain a certain amount of bulging between panels but searching for the tweets showing the NSE tilling being fired of the walls lead to this coming up aswell. |
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Post by spsmiler on May 8, 2019 19:54:46 GMT
Moorgate station platforms 9 & 10 has now also lost its platform wall times. I hope whatever goes up instead will be visually attractive - by which I mean not 'bathroom plain white'.
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Post by AndrewPSSP on Apr 22, 2020 19:52:55 GMT
Wanted to add this to the Northern City line loses NSE thread, but it's now locked - could mods move this post please?
According to Geoff Marshall's newest video the NSE signs facing the platforms at Essex Road are the responsibility of Network Rail, he suggested that these will remain at the station. Wanted to share as I didn't know this before!
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Post by goldenarrow on May 21, 2020 15:09:36 GMT
Photos from NR's KGX Twitter showing the new tiles in place at Essex Road aswell as some of the tunnel cleaning work being done. Hilariously, the stations have still kept their frankenstein appearance even with some fresh tiles!
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