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Post by scheduler on Jun 29, 2022 20:05:11 GMT
Don't know about that, but I was in a car on the Central Line a few days ago, and it had less than 50% lights working and the door bleepers in that car were also not working. I reported that when I alighted.
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Post by bpk on Jun 30, 2022 1:50:54 GMT
Don't know about that, but I was in a car on the Central Line a few days ago, and it had less than 50% lights working and the door bleepers in that car were also not working. I reported that when I alighted. From the collective symptoms you describe, it sounds as though the Data Transmission System (DTS) had tripped in the unit you were travelling in. |
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Post by jimbo on Jul 13, 2022 3:56:32 GMT
Central Line Improvement Programme - The first train was expected to be in service in March 2022, but the current forecast shows this will be more than 160 days late. The programme has been impacted by resourcing challenges, but work continues to recover time and deliver the project as quickly as possible. [TfL Investment Programme report - quarter to 31 March 2022]
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Post by stapler on Jul 13, 2022 8:52:48 GMT
When I started this thread 4 yrs ago, I quoted the Central GM as saying the **new trains** would be here by 2030. Since we now have only twice the life of this thread to go, has anyone heard of any adjustment to that ETA? Seems as if we'll only be getting the last of the re-motored sets by then!
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Post by jimbo on Jul 13, 2022 9:40:11 GMT
With TfL grant funding expiring today, it's hard to make plans for a future!
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Post by bpk on Jul 14, 2022 3:42:08 GMT
When I started this thread 4 yrs ago, I quoted the Central GM as saying the **new trains** would be here by 2030. Since we now have only twice the life of this thread to go, has anyone heard of any adjustment to that ETA? Seems as if we'll only be getting the last of the re-motored sets by then! The GM would only have been taking their cues from whatever the editorial stance on the plans were at that time. Since then we’ve had COVID and the drip fed funding model that has bought with it. Only ten years ago senior LUL managers stated that the “New Tube for London” trains having no cabs. That very quickly changed into, they’ll be modular and removable, to oh actually there’s no money for new signalling so the new trains will have a drivers cab and introduced to run in tripcock mode only. What happened to those senior managers? Many of them left the company and these aspirations went with them. As a wise depot manager once said, you can put a plan on paper but the it usually changes before the ink has dried. |
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Post by coldplayfan18 on Jul 14, 2022 18:42:21 GMT
The first CLIP train was meant to be let into passenger service in September? Is this still likely to happen??
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Post by noddymac on Jul 14, 2022 21:53:05 GMT
I’d be surprised if it does go into service in September, but anything is possible.
Mod edit [Antharro]: Quote removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Jul 31, 2022 10:15:10 GMT
CLIP Train 2 has completed its dynamic testing for now and has returned this week to Acton Works for the fitting of its AC motors.
This is the first train with all interior and AC mods undertaken.
Further Line testing will be ongoing.
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Post by coldplayfan18 on Jul 31, 2022 12:08:53 GMT
Any idea when it will begin passenger service??
Mod edit [Antharro]: Quote removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread.
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Post by stapler on Aug 8, 2022 18:28:08 GMT
Are the upgraded 92TS stock capable of higher line speeds within the existing signalling when the entire Central Line is equipped with them? But I suppose it never will be - NTL will surely have arrived by then... This and the four posts below have been moved from the New tube for London thread - Tom |
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Post by Dstock7080 on Aug 8, 2022 19:21:58 GMT
There is a suggestion that ‘92 Stock will return to 100kph at some point, restricted to 85kph after the Chancery Lane derailment.
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Post by noddymac on Aug 8, 2022 19:58:40 GMT
No time soon I’ve been told.
Mod edit [Antharro]: Quote removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread.
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Post by grumpycat on Aug 10, 2022 11:24:48 GMT
Wont be surprised if its raised when the AC conversion is completed
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Post by xtmw on Aug 11, 2022 19:13:17 GMT
There is a suggestion that ‘92 Stock will return to 100kph at some point, restricted to 85kph after the Chancery Lane derailment. I personally wouldn't be a fan of this, as I have got to speeds where the train is definitely over 85kmh and it is really bumpy, especially the vibration + is the (current) track capable of this? |
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Post by noddymac on Aug 12, 2022 7:21:01 GMT
A mate of mine who is a Test Train Op has confirmed the trains are faster and perform much better.
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Post by stapler on Aug 12, 2022 9:10:32 GMT
A mate of mine who is a Test Train Op has confirmed the trains are faster and perform much better. In which case, what is there to stop 62mph running, especially on the outer sections? The signalling system was designed for it. |
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Post by Chris M on Aug 18, 2022 12:51:33 GMT
Presumably it would first require (almost) all of the fleet to have the modifications applied, extended testing to determine reliability and safety over the long term (nobody wants a repeat of the Chancery Lane derailment) and, if all that proves satisfactory, a new timetable. I don't know what, if any, union agreements would be required, although I presume they would at least want to be convinced it was safe.
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Post by jamesb on Aug 18, 2022 21:34:05 GMT
It is great if the performance is improved but the 1992ts seems more prone to motors cutting out when people lean on the doors - causing the train to jerk (or occasionally crawl along at a snails pace until the driver stops and restarts).
So I wonder if the train having a bit more punch when it pulls out of the station might exacerbate that problem - especially in rush hour?
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 18, 2022 23:21:53 GMT
A mate of mine who is a Test Train Op has confirmed the trains are faster and perform much better. I have been on some snake rattle and ride journeys on the Leyton to Leytonstone section and South Woodford to Woodford. It is fun, but could be a little scary. It is great if the performance is improved but the 1992ts seems more prone to motors cutting out when people lean on the doors - causing the train to jerk (or occasionally crawl along at a snails pace until the driver stops and restarts). So I wonder if the train having a bit more punch when it pulls out of the station might exacerbate that problem - especially in rush hour? That cutting out when people lean against the doors is very irritating. It seems to happen a lot when people lean against the doors, or have things stuck into it. It happens on a lot of other tube stock, not just the 92 stock. <<rincew1nd: Posts merged>> |
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Post by towerman on Aug 19, 2022 9:55:17 GMT
All stock since 67TS have the foreward wire interlocked with the pilot light circuit so that if a door opens the motors drop out,it’s always been a problem with crush loaded trains.
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Post by xtmw on Aug 19, 2022 10:13:59 GMT
I do have to say, the journey from Epping - Woodford is the most bouncy.
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Post by coldplayfan18 on Aug 19, 2022 11:24:32 GMT
Will the new motors help with the noise between Wanstead and Leytonstone at all?
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Post by spsmiler on Aug 19, 2022 13:34:19 GMT
All stock since 67TS have the foreward wire interlocked with the pilot light circuit so that if a door opens the motors drop out,it’s always been a problem with crush loaded trains. I do not recall other train fleets having the same 'Kangaroo Hop' mode as the 1992ts. Maybe its more of a problem on this fleet than older fleets because the doors are externally hung and later fleets had the door mountings designed to reduce the frequency of this issue? I do have to say, the journey from Epping - Woodford is the most bouncy. Perhaps, but compared the 1962ts trains the 1992s ride like the proverbial magic carpet! I always like it when the trains swiftly 'fly' over the A406 North Circular in the Woodford area, this is because of the impression of 'swift rapid transport' given to road users below the bridge. By way of contrast, I am 'less than happy' to see slowly crawling Piccadilly like trains approaching Arnos Grove crossing another bridge over the A406. |
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Post by jamesb on Aug 19, 2022 17:12:35 GMT
I do not recall other train fleets having the same 'Kangaroo Hop' mode as the 1992ts. Maybe its more of a problem on this fleet than older fleets because the doors are externally hung and later fleets had the door mountings designed to reduce the frequency of this issue? I too haven't experienced the same 'Kangaroo Hop' on other lines. I wonder if the shape of the doors, and the larger windows, make it more of an issue on the 92ts? My understanding is that newer trains (2009/SS stock) have a sensitive edge which negates the need for a door leaf to be able to be pushed open to free an obstruction, because the sensitive edge would allow an obstruction to be detected, prompting the doors to be reopened by the driver. So on newer trains the doors don't have the same pushback mechanism? (I recall that on the 2009ts the sensitive door edge caused no end of problems in the early days, but the design was subsequently tweaked). The general point was that transplanting motors which are more powerful into a train that is 30 years old could have unintended consequences, so I hope some testing takes place in a crush loaded train! Mod edit [Antharro]: Quote partially removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread. |
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Post by spsmiler on Aug 20, 2022 13:41:19 GMT
My understanding is that newer trains (2009/SS stock) have a sensitive edge which negates the need for a door leaf to be able to be pushed open to free an obstruction, because the sensitive edge would allow an obstruction to be detected, prompting the doors to be reopened by the driver. So on newer trains the doors don't have the same pushback mechanism? (I recall that on the 2009ts the sensitive door edge caused no end of problems in the early days, but the design was subsequently tweaked). A 'very sensitive' edge was included on the changes applied to the EHO (extra heavy overhaul) 1938 tube stock. This work was done when I was a schoolboy who travelled on the Northern line on a schoolday weekday basis. I was someone who liked to watch what was going on around me and I quickly noticed that on these trains the doors did not close if I was touching the rubber strip when standing in the doorway looking along the platform to see what was going on. Of course I did know which trains had been given an EHO, this was because the work also included fitting them with scrambled eggs (aka: doors open lights on the train roof sides). With apologies if my transport enthusiasm annoyed any train guards by my doing this. Mod edit [Antharro]: Quote partially removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread. |
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Post by d7666 on Aug 20, 2022 14:16:45 GMT
The general point was that transplanting motors which are more powerful into a train that is 30 years old could have unintended consequences, so I hope some testing takes place in a crush loaded train! Are the new motors more powerful though ? This is DC motors replaced by AC motors and all the associated power electronics gubbins. Does not automatically imply more powerful - the project might specify this. AC motors have different characteristics to DC motors and any planned point to point running time changes could simply be taking advantage of these differences, plus AC motor traisn require significantly less maintenance time so they can probably squeeze 2 or more complete trains for traffic out of the fleet (once the whole lot are done). I do not recall seeing any power or other performance values quoted for the new kit, not in this forum, nor anywhere else. I might have missed it if I did not get a search keyword right of course. Can you cite some authoritative actual performance values for 92TS in their upgraded form ? |
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Post by d7666 on Aug 20, 2022 14:25:39 GMT
I do not recall other train fleets having the same 'Kangaroo Hop' mode as the 1992ts. Maybe its more of a problem on this fleet than older fleets because the doors are externally hung and later fleets had the door mountings designed to reduce the frequency of this issue? Just a guess. It might be because 92TS are all axles motored - so the associated sudden drop jerk is bigger? (even if the 32 motors are each smaller than other trains). No other series built stock had all motored axles - until S-stock. Mod edit [Antharro]: Quote partially removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread. |
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Post by towerman on Aug 20, 2022 17:15:23 GMT
R stock was all motored cars.
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Post by t697 on Aug 20, 2022 17:59:10 GMT
As far as I'm aware the new AC drive is supposed to match the existing very closely.
On the point about a door interlock triggered motoring shut off, 92TS peak acceleration is 1.3m/s^2 which is slightly higher than most other stock so the sudden shut off could feel more of a jerk than most other Tube stock.
And on R stock, yes all cars were motored, but on only one axle of the two per bogie.
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