Colin
Advisor
My preserved fire engine!
Posts: 11,346
|
Post by Colin on Jun 16, 2005 4:52:40 GMT
Thanks for respecting my opinion Q8  And you seem to be softening your stance! rbruce1314 - the death penalty is not a punishment. You can't make a person regret their actions if they are dead. Q8 is right, you need to make them suffer - life should mean life, a very hard one with no Independence and working bloody hard to pay for their stay at her majesty's pleasure. And community punishment should be made a lot harder. Again all the hours must be completed, with the work directly related to the crime. If it's graffiti, clean it up. If it's mugging old ladies, an old folks home will always appreciate help. It's nice to see some middle ground being reached. Flogging? here we go again! All it will do is inflict pain for a short time. Will it make a person see the error of their ways? 200 hours community service at 4 hours every day = 50 days. 5 days a week for 10 weeks - that gives them more time to reflect on their behavior. I have to agree that the Law as it stands at the moment is at best weak, and offers no real deterrent to most offenders. Punishments do need to be made far, far tougher, with the sentence being as stated, not halved for 'good behavior'. I'm not budging on physical punishment's though. They ain't the answer. |
|
|
|
Post by chris on Jun 16, 2005 7:09:00 GMT
I think pysical punishment may not work on repeating offenders, but i think if shown some discipline at an early age, they may never need to be arrested for anything.
|
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 16, 2005 7:13:01 GMT
Thanks for respecting my opinion Q8 And you seem to be softening your stance! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Do I? Well it's not from any mercy for the wrongdoers I can assure you! If I seem to be softening it is because I listen to opinions like your own and Mr Igelkotten's (who, sensibly, is keeping well out of all this) If you can't listen to and honour the other man's viewpoint then you are a bigot. I think we ALL agree that it time the law had some teeth and guts to deal with a daily increasing problem. I also think it is time this debate was closed as we have all had a fair say in it. I have emailed DD to apologise as I think we have "hijacked " his wonderful forum for non-tube issues. If he starts a "Life in General" option then we can all rant & rave about anything under the sun in that. I thank you Gents, one and all, for giving me the chance to air my opinions and listening to them without shouting me down. At the end of the day it is US and our friends and relations to make sure the politicians realise that it is time that SOMETHING MUST BE DONE. |
|
|
|
Post by chris on Jun 16, 2005 9:52:49 GMT
I think the odd moral discussion like this would help us get to know each other a bit better out of the railway community. I hope DD doesn't mind too much! If you do, just say the word and we'll stop!
|
|
Igelkotten away from home
Guest
|
Post by Igelkotten away from home on Jun 16, 2005 18:23:40 GMT
Just to put any strange notions to rest: The reason why I haven't posted, and prbably won't be posting in the near future, is that a quite serious case has landed in my lap that I as a union rep have to take care of. Strangely enough, the real life concerns of the members who have elected me comes before an argument on an internet forum. But I have certainly not changed my mind, and I must say that I find quite a few of the "arguments" put forth in this and the other thread hare-brained at best.
/Igelkotten, stressed out.
|
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 16, 2005 19:05:59 GMT
Nice to have a new post from you Mr Igelkotten. I was beginning to think you were ill or that we had all upset you?
I hope the case with your colleague is resolved amicably for all concerned. Of course you are right to put your members needs before the forum, you'd be a poor rep if you did not? If it is a case of managment bullying again I am sure all the LUL guys will be on the side of the victim. We are all aware that you cannot post details of the case as it is "sub judice" so to speak and the members privacy must be honoured as well.
As for the forum, there's no "sides" in the argument really. It is all of us discussing the pro's and con's of a subject that affects us all. We all have our own opinions and convictions and prinicples and we would be poor indeed if we did not listen to and respect the other guys views. Best of luck with the dispute Sir and I'm sure that goes for us all.
|
|
Colin
Advisor
My preserved fire engine!
Posts: 11,346
|
Post by Colin on Jun 17, 2005 2:20:40 GMT
I think the odd moral discussion like this would help us get to know each other a bit better out of the railway community. I hope DD doesn't mind too much! If you do, just say the word and we'll stop! Ditto |
|
Phil
In memoriam
RIP 23-Oct-2018
Posts: 9,473
|
Post by Phil on Jun 17, 2005 9:45:28 GMT
Ditto  . We all seem totally agreed that things have gone too far and appear to be saying the same thing: find a punishment that is preventitive as well as corrective and then apply it ruthlessly and consistently. We only differ in what we think will work and I can live with all opinions on that- thank God we ARE all different (one of me in the world is quite enough for anyone!). |
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 17, 2005 10:00:29 GMT
Ditto thrice.
Come on DD were we right to discuss this thing in your forum or not? As it concerns me we may have been breaking the rules. We don't want your opinion on the subject itself just wether we were in order to do it here?
|
|
|
|
Post by Admin Team on Jun 17, 2005 11:15:15 GMT
Ditto thrice. Come on DD were we right to discuss this thing in your forum or not? As it concerns me we may have been breaking the rules. We don't want your opinion on the subject itself just wether we were in order to do it here? Apologies for the delay in replying either to this thread or to your email Q8. I wasn't ignoring either the threads involved, the topic or the email - it's mainly that I've been busy with a few other things and haven't had the opportunity to give a 'considered' reply! So far as I'm concerened, no 'Rules' have been transgressed. The topic raised itself, and is one worthy of deep discussion, is an emotive topic and one which will, by its nature, attract a myriad of strong views and opinions. I've tried to read all the posts on the matter raised both here and in the other thread and, although perhaps some have seemed a little 'extreme', I think much of this is a generational thing, though I was interested to read the comments of several of our younger members. To be honest, I can't think of any other forum where such a topic COULD have been discussed in such an open and mature way - that says volumes for the contributors here, so well done in the mature and logical way different opinions were discussed, and the respect shown for differing views. But I think the threads have taken their course. I don't propose locking them, but I think it's time to draw a curtain across the discussions. I remain open to different views though! |
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 17, 2005 14:24:40 GMT
HEAR HEAR HEAR and thank you DD. We have all had our say both for and against so if you all agree we will draw a curtain over this emotive issue. There is in the "Transport Forum" a "General Issues" category where we can all spout and splutter to our hearts content. So I think in future if we have any contentious issues to rave about we will do it there and not clutter Dave's site up too much with non-tube stuff. I know for a fact that DD does read that site and the link for it is on the main page. So to finalise, many many thanks to one and all for contributions. But above all thanks to Dave for the chance. THIS ISSUE IS NOW CLOSED.
|
|
|
|
Post by chris on Jun 17, 2005 14:57:53 GMT
Wait a minute - I want to have the last word.
The thread is closed as of NOW.
|
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 17, 2005 15:54:58 GMT
No young 'un I will have the last word and I will say it long before you do (Hopefully)
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2005 17:17:40 GMT
Hehe, there's always one (or two)! ;D
(Oops, seems I have had the last word!)
|
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 17, 2005 17:21:28 GMT
(Oops, seems I have had the last word!)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
GIT !!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by chris on Jun 17, 2005 18:42:24 GMT
DD will end up locking it if you lot carry on with your petty squabbles.
Oh, and would you look at that the last word is, um, mine!!!
|
|
Phil
In memoriam
RIP 23-Oct-2018
Posts: 9,473
|
Post by Phil on Jun 18, 2005 14:20:53 GMT
I'm tempted...
|
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 18, 2005 17:10:24 GMT
Oh dear. This is going to be a long job!
Well...willl you look at that. The old fart has had a word again!!!!
(buggers orf to quietly hide in the corner and ambush any young whippersnappers with the AUDACITY......
|
|
|
|
Post by chris on Jun 18, 2005 18:20:07 GMT
It doesn't have to be a long job. We could just leave MY post last and say I have the last word.................
|
|
Phil
In memoriam
RIP 23-Oct-2018
Posts: 9,473
|
Post by Phil on Jun 18, 2005 20:39:25 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 19, 2005 9:40:13 GMT
Chris- show some respect for your elders  :: ----------------------------------------------------------------------- YES...Harummmppphhh!!!!!!! |
|
|
|
Post by chris on Jun 19, 2005 11:15:45 GMT
Does "Harummmppphhh" count as a word?
|
|
|
|
Post by q8 on Jun 19, 2005 11:27:24 GMT
Harummmppphhh" count as a word?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"COUGH, SPLUTTER, WHEEEEEZZE, CHOKE!!!!"
|
|
|
|
Post by dunois on Jan 21, 2006 12:28:57 GMT
I hope that nobody will mind if I "reopen" this topic. How many of those on this forum would accept the death penalty for the paedophilic murder of a child if it was GUARANTEED that the right person had been convicted (for example by DNA evidence backed up by identification?) I would. But a life sentence with forced work would also be fine for me. I am for corporal punishment but only in certain well defined cases, because if we suppress corporal punishment for parents they can use others methods of punishment as well such as moral punishment with words which can be far more hurting that corporal punishment and have long term effects. I was bullied at school, discussion between me and my bullies was never attempted by the school who prefered to close his eyes on the problem and moreover talk about the problem to a person in charge who then do almost nothing could generally only brings the matter worse as in my case my bully felt that by talking about the problem I "lacked respect to him". In my case the school finally did something and the problem was solved. The main thing is not to flog, slap or beat the perpetrator as punishment, the main thing for me is just simply to punish the person by the best mean necessary in order to have her showing respect to the others and the society in general after her actions. And the first thing to do in order to be respected is to have appropriate punishments like 200 hours of community (hard) work. |
|
