Ben
fotopic... whats that?
Posts: 4,282 
|
Post by Ben on Dec 18, 2011 23:12:51 GMT
Not only are journey times longer than they have been, but tph has been decreased too. One wonders whether the best 'customer' service the tube has had and will ever have was actually 50 years ago, and not some mythical undefined point always in the future...
|
|
mrfs42
71E25683904T 172E6538094T
Big Hair Day
Posts: 5,922
|
Post by mrfs42 on Dec 19, 2011 1:16:47 GMT
One wonders whether the best 'customer' service the tube has had and will ever have was actually 50 years ago, and not some mythical undefined point always in the future... <FB> MDC likes this [1]</FB> [1] and knows what his answer would be through long years and more than a century of information....... |
|
castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
Posts: 1,316
|
Post by castlebar on Dec 19, 2011 15:18:12 GMT
@ North End, > Again, agree to a point. I clearly remember suggesting to somebody with a bit of power in these matters (at that time, which was now about 40 years ago), that the WLL be re-opened for passenger traffic. I was distinctly told it could never happen as it had been tried, failed and thus closed very many years earlier. Therefore, that was "proof" why it was never to be reconsidered.
That type of concrete thinking is (1) why the re-opening took so long, > (2) why I am such a cynic with transport planners, politicians, and most particularly, so-called "consultants", and > (3) why the blindly obvious still doesn't happen sometimes.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2011 16:16:46 GMT
I'm with you castlebar!!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2011 21:16:04 GMT
My Chesham was diverted to Amersham at Chalfont this evening, however for a change the line controller diverted the following Amersham train to Chesham, which was appreciated, Therefore I thank the line controller who is on duty this evening and will not be claiming a refund despite being more than 15 minutes late.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2011 22:59:58 GMT
My Chesham was diverted to Amersham at Chalfont this evening, however for a change the line controller diverted the following Amersham train to Chesham, which was appreciated, Therefore I thank the line controller who is on duty this evening and will not be claiming a refund despite being more than 15 minutes late. Well, it wasn't MetControl as he had already gone home, and not me either! I believe it was my colleague who has his last day at work tomorrow before his retirement. He must have been feeling generous tonight. ;D ;D I'll pass it onto him. |
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Dec 20, 2011 13:17:47 GMT
Had my first go on the Met since the new timetable was introduced.
A couple of questions: Why do the fast services start so late in the afternoon. I assumed that they would start from about 4, but it past 4.30 when the first fast service left Kings Cross. Perhaps if they ran them from 4, it might encourage a few punters to travel a bit earlier and avoid the main part of the peak.
Also, why don't trains returning to London in the evening peak from Amersham / Chesham run fast? Surely it woud be more efficient to get these trains back to Baker Street and Aldgate as quickly as possible so that they can do another run outwards?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2011 13:31:41 GMT
Also, why don't trains returning to London in the evening peak from Amersham / Chesham run fast? Surely it woud be more efficient to get these trains back to Baker Street and Aldgate as quickly as possible so that they can do another run outwards? Sorry but you are talking the one thing no one seems to be listening to at the moment.....sense! As someone who has been on the Met line in various guises over 18 years, it really is disappointing and frustrating to see what is happening and the comments from people using the line in the last 10 days. I just hope certain people open their eyes and see what is going on. We're quickly going from the number 1 line to the status of the Northern during the late 80's. |
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Dec 20, 2011 13:46:27 GMT
Also, why don't trains returning to London in the evening peak from Amersham / Chesham run fast? Surely it woud be more efficient to get these trains back to Baker Street and Aldgate as quickly as possible so that they can do another run outwards? Sorry but you are talking the one thing no one seems to be listening to at the moment.....sense! As someone who has been on the Met line in various guises over 18 years, it really is disappointing and frustrating to see what is happening and the comments from people using the line in the last 10 days. I just hope certain people open their eyes and see what is going on. We're quickly going from the number 1 line to the status of the Northern during the late 80's. And of course, the reliability argument is silly. Was the previous off peak timetable so unreliable, and if so why? When travelling on a slow Amersham yesterday and stopping at Preston Road, I looked at the (unused) fast tracks. I then thought about the Great Eastern main line, which is crying out to be four tracked, and here we are with a pair of tracks virtually unused for large parts of the day. Ironically, they were used for a time in the off peak yesterday when a train (A stock) became defective at Wembley Park. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2011 14:14:54 GMT
The fast lines were used more than that when I took over the Met line yesterday. Lost count of the number I sent fast and non stopping Wembley, trains losing 10-15 minutes for no reason other than too many in the city and on the slow lines!
|
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Dec 20, 2011 14:21:37 GMT
The fast lines were used more than that when I took over the Met line yesterday. Lost count of the number I sent fast and non stopping Wembley, trains losing 10-15 minutes for no reason other than too many in the city and on the slow lines! Harrow on the Hill southbound at about 6pm. There was a train each in both of the southbound platforms and of course, the second one had to wait for the first to leave, as they were both going down the slow lines (as usual!). Quite how this equates to a better service is beyond me. At that time of day, there is a reasonable demand for servcies into Central London, yet this timetable was making the journey longer for no other reason than because of the timetable. I heard numerous people asking why one of the trains isn't a fast service. There was also very slow progress on my Met train between Baker Street and Liverpool Street, due to (in the words of the driver), far too many trains being sent into the city. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2011 14:31:11 GMT
Unfortunately we can't watch every train, had we known of this then the one running latest would more than likely have gone down the fast. As I said, way too many trains in the city and all that blocking back was the result of no incidents!
See what transpires tonight, MetControl is at the helm from 14.00 and I'll be in to make the tea for him from 16.00 ;D ;D
|
|
|
|
Post by redsetter on Dec 20, 2011 14:48:29 GMT
|
|
castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
Posts: 1,316
|
Post by castlebar on Dec 20, 2011 15:01:57 GMT
I see ebay item location is "Watford"
Now, l wonder who lives in Watford and doesn't need his/her new WTT any more.
|
|
pitdiver
No longer gainfully employed
Posts: 439
|
Post by pitdiver on Dec 20, 2011 15:06:46 GMT
I have just read linecontroller66's comment regarding the Met becoming like the Northern of the late 80's. As someone who worked on the Met from 89 onwards I am shocked and stunned. As the premier line of the Combine becoming like the "Black One" God help us.
I have every sympathy for all Met Line staff from Line Controller down to CSA.
|
|
|
|
Post by ruislip on Dec 20, 2011 16:18:51 GMT
Here is my question: As it appears that off-peak there are more off-peaks terminating at Baker St than in previous timetables, doesn't that mean that some of these trains have to reverse in Platforms 2 or 3--causing delays to trains heading to/from Aldgate?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2011 16:28:40 GMT
I am curious why it private and only for staff use? Is there really stuff in there that the general public should not know about? |
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Dec 20, 2011 16:38:38 GMT
Here is my question: As it appears that off-peak there are more off-peaks terminating at Baker St than in previous timetables, doesn't that mean that some of these trains have to reverse in Platforms 2 or 3--causing delays to trains heading to/from Aldgate? Current timetable has 8tph terminating at Baker Street off peak. Previous timetable had 10tph, so actually a reduction because more trains are running through to Aldgate. |
|
castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
Posts: 1,316
|
Post by castlebar on Dec 20, 2011 17:00:31 GMT
When we were at junior school, aged 8, we could ALL read bus and train timetables.
Now, 60 years on, grandchildren with countless degrees from universities all around the U K do not know how to read any timetable, even though to my eyes, they are MUCH simpler to understand these days
|
|
|
|
Post by metrider on Dec 20, 2011 17:53:57 GMT
... Harrow on the Hill southbound at about 6pm. There was a train each in both of the southbound platforms and of course, the second one had to wait for the first to leave, as they were both going down the slow lines (as usual!). ... There was also very slow progress on my Met train between Baker Street and Liverpool Street, due to (in the words of the driver), far too many trains being sent into the city. Indeed, thankfully so far there have been reasonable announcements at Harrow as to which order the trains will depart, but it does seem pointless to delay trains in that way..., and I wonder ho long the information point on p5/6 will be manned - it had been manned much less frequently in the preceding few weeks. My 'feeling' was that between Harrow and Wembley s/b in the evening peak, the trains were queueing and being further spread apart by the signals between Northwick park and Preston road. I was surprised as the previous departure was quite a bit more than two mins before the train I was on (hence I assumed the previous train was also queued. All the more confusing as I also see trains waiting to enter service s/b from the depot as we pass. Whilst the lines south of the depot seem to run as freely as they did before, I'm assuming that injecting extra trains at that time must delay Wembley departures a little (contributing to the queue to get into Wembley?). True if on the old timetables you caught the wrong train, you could be held at Wembley, but not usually before that. I'd say that last week, my outbound morning journeys to HoH in the morning peak were the expected 3 mins longer. Back into town in the evening probably about 5mins longer due to the slower running and extra stops. On one day, I was 'lucky' and caught a late running train that was diverted onto the fasts. In the old timetable I'd nearly always wait for a fast or semi fast that was immediately following a slow (and usually gain a minute or two). On my eve trip back into town, catching a certain fast train would save me about four mins over the adjacent slow (and anyone doing the pt 5/6 shuffle at HoH at that time and travelling into the city, might even catch up with an Aldgate six minutes ahead of sitting on the slow on which they arrived.) I can sort of see how the new timetable balances the service frequency north of HoH across the branches, but the long reach of the Met does outreach the other lines that have been noted as having only 'all-stations' services earlier in this thread, so I can understand the reasoning for the Met to be a special case for selected fast running. All in all. the new timetable is a step backward methinks. |
|
|
|
Post by alfie on Dec 20, 2011 20:29:28 GMT
I am curious why it private and only for staff use? Is there really stuff in there that the general public should not know about? Rolling Stock Working, spare and empty trains etc, some members of the public maybe shouldn't know this, none of us need to anyway. |
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Dec 20, 2011 20:32:36 GMT
I am curious why it private and only for staff use? Is there really stuff in there that the general public should not know about? Rolling Stock Working, spare trains etc, some members of the public maybe shouldn't know this, none of us need to anyway. Although it is all freely available through the Freedom of Information act! |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2011 21:09:24 GMT
I've got a copy of 331, perhaps I can flog it on ebay too!
|
|
Ben
fotopic... whats that?
Posts: 4,282
|
Post by Ben on Dec 20, 2011 21:41:42 GMT
Suprised some are going spare, heard a few times that the drivers made a scrum for the latest wtt as soon as it came out!
|
|
|
|
Post by superteacher on Dec 20, 2011 21:54:17 GMT
Suprised some are going spare, heard a few times that the drivers made a scrum for the latest wtt as soon as it came out! I thought all drivers got issued with a WTT anyway. |
|
|
|
Post by alfie on Dec 20, 2011 22:42:44 GMT
Yeah, but ya wanna get it quick  |
|
|
|
Post by citysig on Dec 20, 2011 22:50:04 GMT
The whole point about our internal working timetables - just as for any timetable in any industry - is that they form part of the toolkit to do our job with, and they contain nothing that the public needs to travel.
It doesn't matter whether you can get hold of old / out of date timetables as their worth (as far as the operators is concerned) is no more.
Expensive FOI requests do nothing to lower your fares. Someone needs to be employed to be there to deal with such requests. Somehow their wages need paying.
Apart from the possible security implications from the information contained within (such as when certain trains stable and where) you as the traveller get all the information you need whilst travelling. With the introduction of this timetable, even the Met is now meant to be "turn up and go" so the need for detailed timetables is no more.
The ebay seller and anyone else (non-staff) who has a copy of WTT 331 should maybe not make it so common knowledge they have one (or more). Should our management catch up with the ebay person, and they are staff, they could land themselves in very serious trouble indeed. And of course it really doesn't take a genius to find such people. I already have 2 personal suspicions of my own - and I'm not a manager looking for them.
One extremely annoying side-effect from people who have obtained timetable information, is that they do tend to try and do our job. They often recite particular trains and timings and tend to make recommendations based on a book they have no authority to read. However, it is rare for such people to actually find the real reason their journey went one way or another based on just the timetable itself.
|
|
|
|
Post by citysig on Dec 20, 2011 22:54:30 GMT
See what transpires tonight, MetControl is at the helm from 14.00 and I'll be in to make the tea for him from 16.00 ;D ;D It ran very well whilst I was at the helm of course, but alas I'm still waiting for that tea ;D ;D |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2011 23:32:19 GMT
See what transpires tonight, MetControl is at the helm from 14.00 and I'll be in to make the tea for him from 16.00 ;D ;D It ran very well whilst I was at the helm of course, but alas I'm still waiting for that tea ;D ;D He was travelling via the Met. By the time he got to you it was cold ;D To be serious, this sale of a WTT, or any company confidential document, concerns me, not only due of the information contained but more importantly because of the attitude it portrays towards his employers. It is a breach of trust which suggests that he views LU purely as a source of salary and any other income he can milk. Regardless of blame LU has got itself into a hole with the Met and needs a united organisation to recover. There is an old maxim that you don't bite the hand that feeds you; in my opinion anyone who gets caught behaving like this has only himself to blame if he gets booted out. |
|
|
|
Post by alfie on Dec 20, 2011 23:43:17 GMT
If you do an FOI they give you photocopies anyway.*whistles*
I'm sorry, i was intrigued. I won't make your fares go up again.
|
|
