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Post by jimmy on Jul 19, 2005 20:40:10 GMT
I know that older LUL stock have simple drawcords for each shoe, which the driver can pull one by one. What I'm wondering is if newer stock (92-95-96) have a powered option for lifting shoegear? I'd also like to ask Mr. Igelkotten if the Stockholm tunnelbana is equipped like this, having top-contact third rail similar to London. In Oslo, whose "t-bane" I am aquainted with through a friend of mine who drives there, its possible for a train to instantly retrieve all its current collecting shoes and thus make the train powerless in case of emergency. Using the under-contact third rail system this is facilitated by releasing the air pressure pressing the shoes agains the rail. The function is useful in circumstances like electrical faults and "person under train"; in the "salvage space" underneath the platform edge where persons could otherwise get in touch with live shoegear. Obviously all current consumption on the train must cease before shoes can be retrieved, otherwise some significant arcing would occur! For this reason all trains have a master overload that can be tripped at any time, even while motoring in parallell/full throttle. This is done automatically when the shoe-retrieval is activated. The Oslo system is interesting in being inspired by Stockholm, especially regarding interior layout and general design of the first generations of cars. The CAB-signalling is also swedish-inspired, though Oslo has five possible codes rather than Stockholms three: 15-30-50-70 km/h and the U-code. The U-code tells the train that the driver is allowed to drive on sight up to full speed until another code is received. This is used on one line, Kolsåsbanen, where the for this purpose specially equipped trains also switch to overhead contact wire (pantograph on roof) and share tracks with the city trams for some distance! For some pictures: trikkogbane.info/cgi-bin/side.pl?id=2200&lang=2Sorry about the digression, thought I'd just like to share some of what little "Underground" we have in Norway  Myself, I'm a part-time driver at the countrys only public funicular, Floibanen in Bergen. At other times I'm a student at the local university. Best regards, Jimmy |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2005 22:41:18 GMT
Correct me if I am wrong, however the conventionl PSLG & NSLG are still features of the newer Stock.
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Post by igelkotten on Jul 20, 2005 16:17:46 GMT
Morrn, morrn!
Actually, the Stockholm system of third rail is more similar to US ones, such as the third rail employed on parts of the former New York Central, Long Island Railroad and, of course, the NY subway. Third rail collector shoes in Britain are normally placed above the third rail, and does not extend out a significant amount from the bogie. We use a system where the collector shoe is placed on the end of two spring-loaded arms, and extends out from the bogie for a fair distance -say 45 cm or so.
Now, the old stock here in Stockholm ("Cx", the C1-C15) cars, do not really have a facility for lifting the shoes. They can of course be dismounted in a workshop for whatever purposes, but not in normal service. If a car has to be isolated, you would go underneath the car, open an euipment cubilcle and throw a knife switch -preferrably not looking directly at it whilst doing so. If a car with damaged shoes has to be moved, and there is a risk of the damaged shoe causing further damage to the third rail or other lineside equipment, it is time for the bolt cutters or the "polo mallet" -a broad and heavy axe-blade like thing on a long wooden spar, used to chop off or strike off a faulty shoe.
The C20 stock has shoes designed to be lifted, but only manually. You apply a big rubberized fork-like thing to the shoe, give it a sort of twist and lift, and then you can lift up the shoe and latch it in a locked position. Very useful when they were delivered by mainline rail from Västerås.
If you want to cut of a C20 from the traction supply, you just throw a switch in the cab, and while the shoes may continue to be energised on an individual level, the shoes are cut off from the power converter feed, and thus the car is cut off. There is also a manual knife switch located underneath the C20 for those times when you have to kill everything.
Some of the locomotives and other engineer's equipment here in Stockholm do have power-operated shoelift gear, but that is about all.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Jul 20, 2005 17:28:35 GMT
If a car with damaged shoes has to be moved, and there is a risk of the damaged shoe causing further damage to the third rail or other lineside equipment, it is time for the bolt cutters or the "polo mallet" -a broad and heavy axe-blade like thing on a long wooden spar, used to chop off or strike off a faulty shoe. Was that the sort of thing we played with down at KTG? |
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Post by russe on Jul 20, 2005 18:56:07 GMT
Dunno what 'PSLG' and 'NSLG' are (you professionals should really explain your acronyms, at least at their first mention), but I understand that the shoegear on all new network rail stock is required to be what is termed 'frangible', i.e. in case of breakage, it comes off and disconnects itself without damage to track, bogies, or personnel. Not sure whether there is a requirement for the shoegear to be retractable.
Russ
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2005 19:10:45 GMT
Dunno what 'PSLG' and 'NSLG' are (you professionals should really explain your acronyms, at least at their first mention), PSLG: Positive Shoe Lifting Gear NSLG: Negative Shoe Lifting Gear. Equipment to raise shoes. |
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Post by jimmy on Jul 20, 2005 20:37:14 GMT
Thanks for the replies, og en særlig takk til naboen i øst! Det er et nydelig system dere har, forbigår vår nedslitte t-bane på alle områder...
Some further notes from me:
The old Oslo stock (T1-T8) is also equipped with a special device for shoe disconnection - an arm made of special fiberglass that fits to the same "knob" as the shed receptacles. It resembles a spark plug assembly in many ways... The driver also has a short-circuiting device for emergency use. A big difference to all London stock is that each car of a train is a self-contained motorised unit with shoes on all bogies, as on Stockholms CX-stock.
The under-contact system has proven itself in Oslo for the last near 40 years. In wintertime there is little trouble with ice build-up so the trains don't need de-icing equipment. Also the safety is apparently better, last year for instance the only third rail related injury was that of a drunk who had gone to sleep underneath it at a suburban station (probably figured it was a heater!). Upon waking up he banged his head on the rail, but luckily only sustained minor bruising. Trackworkers are reportedly quite happily eating lunch while seated on the rails insulated cover.
Best regards,
jimmy
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Post by q8 on Jul 20, 2005 21:36:46 GMT
Trackworkers are reportedly quite happily eating lunch while seated on the rails insulated cover.
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I've also seen that done in Berlin
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towerman
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Post by towerman on Jul 20, 2005 22:09:57 GMT
59/62TS,67,72,73TS C69/77,D78 all have or had retractable shoegear.I believe the A60/62's had it fitted either on coversion to OPO or on refurb.
95/96TS has pneumatically retractable shoegear,you have the choice of isolating a unit or a train.
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Igelkotten on another computer
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Post by Igelkotten on another computer on Jul 20, 2005 23:20:24 GMT
If a car with damaged shoes has to be moved, and there is a risk of the damaged shoe causing further damage to the third rail or other lineside equipment, it is time for the bolt cutters or the "polo mallet" -a broad and heavy axe-blade like thing on a long wooden spar, used to chop off or strike off a faulty shoe. Was that the sort of thing we played with down at KTG? Yep, that was a longer version of the wooden mallet. Remind me next time we are in HÖ, and I'll show you one of the axe-like things. About the same as the mallet you saw, but with a heavy steel blade instead, to cut off the struts to the shoe on Cx stock. The struts are actually constructed with "cut-off" sections, to be broken more easily. |
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Post by Pindesoet on Jul 20, 2005 23:24:09 GMT
Thanks for the replies, og en særlig takk til naboen i øst! Det er et nydelig system dere har, forbigår vår nedslitte t-bane på alle områder... Some further notes from me: The old Oslo stock (T1-T8) is also equipped with a special device for shoe disconnection - an arm made of special fiberglass that fits to the same "knob" as the shed receptacles. It resembles a spark plug assembly in many ways... The driver also has a short-circuiting device for emergency use. A big difference to all London stock is that each car of a train is a self-contained motorised unit with shoes on all bogies, as on Stockholms CX-stock. The under-contact system has proven itself in Oslo for the last near 40 years. In wintertime there is little trouble with ice build-up so the trains don't need de-icing equipment. Also the safety is apparently better, last year for instance the only third rail related injury was that of a drunk who had gone to sleep underneath it at a suburban station (probably figured it was a heater!). Upon waking up he banged his head on the rail, but luckily only sustained minor bruising. Trackworkers are reportedly quite happily eating lunch while seated on the rails insulated cover. Best regards, jimmy Nydelig?  As long as you don't have to work there, I suppose...  We did have the forks and short-circuiting devices in our old cars up until some years ago, but now they are carried on our befälsbilar (response unit cars) instead. Normally, short circuiting devices are only employed on worksites -in an emergency, the preferred method is to contact line control and have them make an emergency power shutdown on the section. |
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Myself, I'm a part-time driver at the countrys only public funicular, Floibanen in Bergen. At other times I'm a student at the local university.
