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Post by harlesden on Jul 3, 2010 7:49:16 GMT
Does anybody happen to know how the seating capacity per carriage of a modern DMU - with the majority of seating in a carriage facing in the same direction - compares with older slam-door DMU's that had seats facing each other.
I assume passenger capacity is the reason for the modern layout.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2010 22:01:42 GMT
(first post, be nice!)
I think the same could be said for the new layouts of the HST Mk IIIs - basically squeezed in, hence the fact that whereas before the seats were aligned with the windows, they're put in now to get the maximum number of seats.
(I'm from Devon, so use FGWs HST fleet fairly frequently!)
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slugabed
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Post by slugabed on Jul 3, 2010 22:41:56 GMT
Yes,a retrograde step....when they started doing this sort of thing,they had the cheek to advertise "Airline-type seats"....seats on 'planes are cramped and uncomfortable and nothing to boast of.
A real boast would be airlines advertising that they had "Train-type" seats.
But now that so many trains have cheap'n'nasty seating,people have forgotten quite how comfortable even basic commuter stock can be.I cite the 2-HAP units as a prime example of best practice.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2010 0:09:20 GMT
Thing is, local commutes are pretty short and space is at a premium. Would you rather miss the train trough lack of space or get on it and stand for what amounts to a small amount of your life?
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jul 4, 2010 12:09:08 GMT
(first post, be nice!) I think the same could be said for the new layouts of the HST Mk IIIs - basically squeezed in, hence the fact that whereas before the seats were aligned with the windows, they're put in now to get the maximum number of seats. Actually, the Mark 3 was the first BR rolling stock where the windows did NOT line up with the seats, as the same bodyshell was used for both First and Second class, with the window spacing arranged to align with the seat spacing in First Class. The more recent introduction of face-to-back seating makes matters worse, of course. As built, and until SWT ruined them, the seating in the mark 3- derived Class 455-family electric units matched the window spacing, so you got a view out unless you sat in the unpopular narrow seat in the corner next to the door pockets, where the seats are also narrower. (Glazed door pockets were one of the innovations introduced on the 1935 tube stock, but have never caught on, on the Big Railway). |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Jul 7, 2010 13:55:25 GMT
Thing is, local commutes are pretty short and space is at a premium. Would you rather miss the train trough lack of space or get on it and stand for what amounts to a small amount of your life? If space is at a premium on commuter stock they should be running longer trains (if HSTs can call at Stonehouse this shouldn't be too much of an issue) or using longitudinal seating as on the 378s. The seating on intercity and regional stock (158s, etc) should be designed for passenger comfort. Living in Somerset I have little choice but to suffer FGW operations. The company seems to think it has only two sorts of trains - DMUs and HSTs (and they refurbished the latter to try and make them as uncomfortable as some of the former), treating a pacer and a 158 as equally suitable for any journey (143s have appeared on Cardiff-Penzance operations and 158s, designed as regional express units, on the Severn Beach line). A year or so back some DMU diagrams were operated by hired in mark 2 coaching stock top-and-tailed by Class 67s. FGW put in prominent notices apologising for the better train (greater capacity, roomier, more comfortable seats). When I sent in a comment saying how much I preferred these trains I was assured that my journey would return to normal shortly and apologies were once again offered for not transporting me in a cattle wagon. Back on topic, the airline-style seating as a capacity measure is really only suitable for the short periods at the peak shoulders when other options (longitudinal seating, longer trains) would work equally well. The absence of table seating has frequently been cited as a major disincentive for families to travel by rail. |
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Post by andypurk on Jul 7, 2010 14:15:58 GMT
Thing is, local commutes are pretty short and space is at a premium. Would you rather miss the train trough lack of space or get on it and stand for what amounts to a small amount of your life? If space is at a premium on commuter stock they should be running longer trains (if HSTs can call at Stonehouse this shouldn't be too much of an issue) or using longitudinal seating as on the 378s. The seating on intercity and regional stock (158s, etc) should be designed for passenger comfort. Running trains longer than platforms, on commuter services, is a recipe for late running if more than a door is off the end. This being due to the time taken to get passengers through the train and off (or on) it. |
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Post by mcmaddog on Jul 7, 2010 14:26:47 GMT
Running trains longer than platforms, on commuter services, is a recipe for late running if more than a door is off the end. This being due to the time taken to get passengers through the train and off (or on) it. Surely you mean leisure services? On commuter services the commuters will know which door is the best to get out of. |
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Post by andypurk on Jul 7, 2010 15:13:49 GMT
Running trains longer than platforms, on commuter services, is a recipe for late running if more than a door is off the end. This being due to the time taken to get passengers through the train and off (or on) it. Surely you mean leisure services? On commuter services the commuters will know which door is the best to get out of. No I don't. Consider a full and standing train, how is the commuter supposed to get out having got on at the rear at the last minute? There are very few commuter services where there are platforms shorter than trains(exceptions being towards the country end of routes where crowding will no longer be an issue when the train gets there), but there are a lot served by less time critical 'leisure services'. On commuter routes, platforms are generally lengthened before the trains get longer. |
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Post by geebeezed on Jul 7, 2010 15:53:29 GMT
There are also other considerations taken into account for Seating rather than just cramming 'em in, did you know there are standards for the amount of ambient light a seat gets? This was what posessed FGW to install the headache inducing lighting in the refurbished HSTs, the 'at seat' light levels being too low after they decided to tint the windows!! Thankfully common sense seems to have prevailed & they've turned half the lights off!!  |
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