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Post by ethano92345 on Jul 1, 2018 20:55:21 GMT
Something I like about the indicators on the Central line is that, most of the time, it says "Mind the Doors" when the doors about to close. I think that's a good feature which should be implemented on all of the boards across the network. I also like the big text and the fact that the lights aren't too bright. One thing I don't like about the new DMIs is 1) their size and 2) the brightness of the diodes. Even with my eyesight I can't read it unless I get fairly close. The central line does have the best DMIs, they're quite big and very clear. I still see posters and hear announcements about train doors closing 30 seconds before departure, I even saw one poster at the East Midland platforms at St Pancras claiming train doors will be locked shut up to 120 seconds before departure, what's the point? I doubt they'd ever do that. In practise, trains often only close their doors 10 or so seconds before departure. I was walking down the platforms at Waterloo today and the train was leaving in 2 minutes, many decided to board and walk through but I find that annoying to do with the 3+2 seating, anyway, I will admit the auto close scared me and I jumped on even though I still had another minute. My usual train out of Waterloo is a 455 which only have rather slow manual doors between cars and I often see people sprint to their carriage if the trains about to leave because walking between carrieges is quite frustrating especially if someone is sitting in the seats by the doors. Back on auto-close, I noticed the 710s have a door close button from Geoff's video which seems pointless since TFL disabled the ones on the 378s. Also, the 345s which are obviously also an Aventura are also great at closing after only a 4 or 5 seconds of inactivity and honestly don't even need a door close button. |
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Post by jamesb on Jul 2, 2018 3:39:06 GMT
Central line trains also seem to 'pssssssssst' when they are ready to leave, with a brief release of air. I always wondered if this happens automatically, or if the driver does it?
If the S stock are to have a white flashing light on every carriage when the trains are ready to leave (with the new signalling), that will make it pretty obvious to passengers that the train is ready to go, the LEDs are very bright.
Maybe the best compromise is the current DLR system, whereby doors have to be opened by pressing a button but remain open.
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Post by t697 on Jul 2, 2018 5:20:11 GMT
If the S stock are to have a white flashing light on every carriage when the trains are ready to leave (with the new signalling), that will make it pretty obvious to passengers that the train is ready to go, the LEDs are very bright. AIUI, the white light will be steady not flashing for ready to depart. The flashing version will be to indicate where a Passenger Alarm has been operated. |
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Post by ad1992 on Jul 2, 2018 5:46:44 GMT
It does still work the only problem is firstly the doors won't open from the outside, and secondly passengers just stand at the doors waiting for them to open. How do you know it still works when it is never used?
I know a driver and he tried using it a short while ago when the weather was really cold. The passengers on the inside managed to press door open to alight but the outside passengers couldn't get in to any carriages where the saloon door panels hadn't been pressed. One or two did try the outer buttons but they didn't work.. Suffice to say he turned it back to driver operate mode again.
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Post by nickf on Jul 2, 2018 9:38:41 GMT
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Post by moogal on Jul 2, 2018 13:33:15 GMT
Something I like about the indicators on the Central line is that, most of the time, it says "Mind the Doors" when the doors about to close. I think that's a good feature which should be implemented on all of the boards across the network. Personally I'm not a fan of this as it replaces the next departure underneath - quite often when entering a platform with a train there, I want to know if I should try to squeeze my way onto this one, or whether there's a (probably) emptier one right behind it. If there was some other way to provide the same information that would be better. |
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Post by goldenarrow on Jul 2, 2018 15:34:34 GMT
Something I like about the indicators on the Central line is that, most of the time, it says "Mind the Doors" when the doors about to close. I think that's a good feature which should be implemented on all of the boards across the network. Personally I'm not a fan of this as it replaces the next departure underneath - quite often when entering a platform with a train there, I want to know if I should try to squeeze my way onto this one.... Which is exactly why I would argue that the all the departures should vanish when *MIND THE DOORS* is displayed. That's not going to stop all the offenders of course but I'd wager that it would certainly make passengers who require specific branches to think twice if they can't be sure. |
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Post by croxleyn on Jul 2, 2018 18:38:45 GMT
Why should the doors lock closed at a set time before departure - this irritates me on the GWR? Surely, as far as passengers are concerned, the timetabled departure should be at the instant passengers can no longer board a train. So a "working" timetable should absorb this enforced delay.
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Post by andrewpssp on Jul 2, 2018 21:18:31 GMT
It's probably so that they can check that all the doors are closed and do some other safety shenanigans. It's not only GWR, it's happened at all the main termini I've taken a train from - maybe it's an industry wide thing? You wouldn't like the doors of a HST to open while it's running at over 100mph, would you  Surely, as far as passengers are concerned, the timetabled departure should be at the instant passengers can no longer board a train. So a "working" timetable should absorb this enforced delay. But then again, most passenger know the time of their train and will arrive at least ~5 minutes before the time.  (Picture from Flickr, taken by LewisBrownlow) I'll stop myself before I get in trouble for talking too much about NR  |
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tut
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Post by tut on Jul 2, 2018 22:11:31 GMT
It's probably so that they can check that all the doors are closed and do some other safety shenanigans. It's not only GWR, it's happened at all the main termini I've taken a train from - maybe it's an industry wide thing? You wouldn't like the doors of a HST to open while it's running at over 100mph, would you Er well kind of, I suppose it's related. Certainly with slam door stock it takes time to close all the doors on the train, but they all have central door locking now. It is due to the time taken to get the doors all closed and locked and be sure that they are, but I wouldn't exactly say there's 30 seconds worth of 'safety shenanigans'. The door closure sequence can take a little bit of time, even with power operated doors. You've gotta spot your moment, switch the CD visual (Close Doors) on, wait for the doors to close, check everything's all in order and then give the Right Away. It does take a little bit of time certainly. And importantly, it can't start until the signal's clear. So that's really it, you wanna clear the signal about 40 seconds to a minute before departure to give time to complete the sequence and to make sure that there's time for things to go wrong. So let's say the process takes 10 or 15 seconds. You wouldn't wanna clear the signal only 10 or 15 seconds before departure time, you gotta allow for the runners, you gotta allow for the fact that the doors might need reopening to free Mr Punter's bag and so on. You clear the signal early, you start the door closure process early, and if everything runs smoothly you have a short wait and then you're ready to go. But if it doesn't go smoothly, you have that buffer, you have the time to have another go. Otherwise, you're gonna get trains routinely getting underway late. And for all the time the train's not moving after it was supposed to leave, the station throat's locked up. Trains are arriving, wanting to go into the platform and it's not vacant. Other trains can't depart until the train with the clear signal has gone. If a train doesn't vacate a platform on time, the next one will arrive in the platform late, possibly delaying another departure. At a busy terminus it can all go to hell in a handcart quite quickly if the train doesn't go when it's supposed to. Especially if you've got 18 platforms and a departure crosses half a dozen of em. Much better to have the signal off and the train already ready to go when the time to leave comes.
Moving away from termini, similar principles still apply. If you're a stopping service on a 2-track railway you really wanna be departing on time or things might start stacking up behind you. And even if it's not a dense service, you don't wanna be finding yourself at a busy, critical junction 2 minutes behind time if you don't have to.
Anyway, I really think anyone turning up to a station less than two minutes early to catch a service with an interval of more than, say, 10 minutes, really only has themselves to blame if they have a bit of a wait.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jul 2, 2018 22:44:59 GMT
Whilst I have sympathy with all the above, operators should not dispatch a train if people are making a connection, or when a platform alteration has been announced at the last minute and people are still coming across. "Running to the timetable" should mean the public timetable, and people have a reasonable expectation that the operator should not prevent them getting to their destination at more or less the advertised time if they have turned up at their originating station on time.
Ultimately, it is not about getting the trains to the end of the line, it's about moving people. A train arriving at the end of the line on time is pointless if it was achieved only by leaving everyone behind.
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Post by andrewpssp on Jul 2, 2018 23:03:31 GMT
As long as they all have a ticket and don't demand compensation, it's all good! |
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domh245
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Post by domh245 on Jul 3, 2018 5:29:00 GMT
Whilst I have sympathy with all the above, operators should not dispatch a train if people are making a connection, or when a platform alteration has been announced at the last minute and people are still coming across. "Running to the timetable" should mean the public timetable, and people have a reasonable expectation that the operator should not prevent them getting to their destination at more or less the advertised time if they have turned up at their originating station on time. Ultimately, it is not about getting the trains to the end of the line, it's about moving people. A train arriving at the end of the line on time is pointless if it was achieved only by leaving everyone behind. Running across the overbridge because of a platform alteration I can understand, but connections are more of a grey area - how many people are trying to make that connection vs how many people are already on the train (and will be inconvenienced by the subsequent late running of the train) Also, define turning up on time, if you get to the gateline at xx:54 when the train leaves at xx:55 then I have little sympathy should you miss it (prior delays on other modes being the exception) |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jul 3, 2018 6:56:14 GMT
but connections are more of a grey area - how many people are trying to make that connection vs how many people are already on the train (and will be inconvenienced by the subsequent late running of the train) How about a cross-platform connection, full-and-standing class 153 (so over fifty people) arrives and disgorges passengers only to have the doors of their connecting service closed in their faces? And the (not-)connecting service arrived in London two minutes early, according to Real Time Trains. |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Jul 3, 2018 7:21:29 GMT
In early April, circa 10 people were travelling on a delayed Northern train from Skipton to Leeds wanting to connect with the last direct train to London of the night. The guard of the Northern service phoned ahead and arranged for the connection to be held, for the train to be put into the adjacent bay platform so it would be a cross-platform interchange and put us all at the front of the train so we were all together and so would transfer as one unit.
However at some point "they" (and I still haven't found out if this was Northern, Network Rail or VTEC) "changed their minds" and decided the connection wouldn't be held and out train would arrive on platform 1 as originally intended. They didn't tell the guard this of course, so he couldn't tell us. This meant that the London train departed as we alighted the ex-Skipton train.
Yesterday morning (nearly 3 months after submitted the delay repay claim) Northern finally got back to us saying they were rejecting the claim on the basis that they believed we caught the London train which departed one minute after we arrived. Even assuming their times are correct, there was no way even an unencumbered able bodied young person can change between platforms 1 and 8 at Leeds in less than 1 minute (and nobody attempting to make the connection fit that description) - the official connection time at the station is 10 minutes.
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