Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2016 17:46:42 GMT
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Post by patrickb on Sept 7, 2016 18:12:12 GMT
Very interesting. I for one would have preferred to see Ticket Offices kept open at certain stations. It's understandable why cuts need to be made, however, they remained a valuable asset to many travellers, especially at Central Area Stations and Stations with interchanges to other rail services.
Many Ticket Windows have been stripped down and already replaced with Ticket machines. So it's unclear how these changes can be 'reversed', if this is to be the outcome of this review. KCSP had all Ticket Windows removed at all three Ticket Halls and I doubt there will be much incentive in reversing this.
On the other hand, some stations particularly ones retaining more history, have had Ticket Windows closed but only covered over with sticky-back posters. Depending on what condition Ticket Offices are in and where they are located, many could potentially be re-opened.
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North End
Beneath Newington Causeway
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Post by North End on Sept 7, 2016 21:57:16 GMT
Hopefully they will start by looking at Euston, which has been a total disaster zone since the booking office closed - especially at weekends. Liverpool Street is awful too, and King's Cross isn't much better at times. Meanwhile Euston Square lost the booking office windows but gained nothing, just left with some machines such as those badly positioned at the bottom of one of the entrance stairwells. Meanwhile plenty of pretty lightly used stations across Britain still maintain a booking office service, yet at present LU deems it uneconomic to provide such a service even at the busiest locations. Funny old world at times.
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Post by snoggle on Sept 7, 2016 22:52:57 GMT
It was a manifesto commitment. It was accidentally revealed at the Assembly T'Port Ctte two months ago that London Travelwatch were likely to be doing the review work. Given they have a long standing commitment to opposing ticket office closures or reductions in hours it will be interesting to see how they do this work. They were also outraged that LU / TfL, no doubt under Mayoral instruction, refused to conduct a public consultation on the TO closure plans so they did their own! Even if LTW do support / propose the reinstatement of ticket offices at some locations I've no idea where the money will come from to unpick the mad dash approach to removing ticket offices from public view. I suspect there may be an "element" within TfL who might quite like to see some ticket offices put back as there is the likely need to swap people's Oyster Cards from the current design to the new one at some point in 2017/18. Trying to do that with roving staff at ticket machines is a hiding to nothing as you need to swap over PAYG balances, registration details, discounts, season tickets etc etc from the old card to the new one and link back to any account. Having a core of ticket offices perhaps supplemented by roving facilities would provide a better basis from which to do the card conversion task. I still think a smallish network of "TfL Shops" that offer a whole range of TfL services including public transport ticketing, information, other payments is a perfectly viable concept and need not just be at tube stations.
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rincew1nd
Administrator
Junior Under-wizzard of quiz
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Post by rincew1nd on Sept 7, 2016 23:10:11 GMT
Meanwhile plenty of pretty lightly used stations across Britain still maintain a booking office service, yet at present LU deems it uneconomic to provide such a service even at the busiest locations. Funny old world at times. In the MerseyTravel area every station has a member of staff present from first to last train. The Booking Clerk at my nearest station doubled his weekly sales when I bought my All Line Rover the other year!
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Post by stapler on Sept 8, 2016 7:10:57 GMT
It was a manifesto commitment. It was accidentally revealed at the Assembly T'Port Ctte two months ago that London Travelwatch were likely to be doing the review work. Given they have a long standing commitment to opposing ticket office closures or reductions in hours it will be interesting to see how they do this work. They were also outraged that LU / TfL, no doubt under Mayoral instruction, refused to conduct a public consultation on the TO closure plans so they did their own! Even if LTW do support / propose the reinstatement of ticket offices at some locations I've no idea where the money will come from to unpick the mad dash approach to removing ticket offices from public view. I suspect there may be an "element" within TfL who might quite like to see some ticket offices put back as there is the likely need to swap people's Oyster Cards from the current design to the new one at some point in 2017/18. Trying to do that with roving staff at ticket machines is a hiding to nothing as you need to swap over PAYG balances, registration details, discounts, season tickets etc etc from the old card to the new one and link back to any account. Having a core of ticket offices perhaps supplemented by roving facilities would provide a better basis from which to do the card conversion task. I still think a smallish network of "TfL Shops" that offer a whole range of TfL services including public transport ticketing, information, other payments is a perfectly viable concept and need not just be at tube stations. Snoggle, why are Oystercards having to be changed over, and when will this happen? Likely to cause chaos at KXSP and Heathrow, as tourists turn up with 2006 Oysters unused for a decade.
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Post by rheostar on Sept 8, 2016 9:00:53 GMT
In the end it will come down to money.
With the Mayor's commitment to not raising fares, budgets are already squeezed very tight.
Reinstating booking offices, even at a few selected sites, would cost millions that TfL doesn't have.
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class411
Operations: Normal
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Post by class411 on Sept 9, 2016 8:06:40 GMT
Of course, it is a failing of the TFL system that it never checks that the presenter of the card is actually entitled to use it. No different from cash - that can be stolen too. Yes, but if you drop a £5 note and don't notice, you've lost £5. If you drop a contactless cc/dc you'll lose up to the amount (or amount of uses) set before the card asks for PIN verification. If you drop an Oyster and don't notice, and it's on auto top-up, you could end up losing quite a bit. Especially as the auto top up notification can be a couple of days after the journey that instigated it. But, as I said, it doesn't seem to be much of a problem.
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Post by superteacher on Sept 10, 2016 11:06:16 GMT
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Post by spsmiler on Oct 7, 2016 20:27:51 GMT
The Mayor Of London has asked London Travelwatch to review changes at London Underground stations, particularly the closure of ticket offices and their impact on customer service. More information can be found at this link: www.londontravelwatch.org.uk/ticketofficereview As someone who has been directly affected by a ticket office closure which left me unable to buy the correct ticket for my journey (I needed a type of ticket which is not available to passengers using Oyster / contactless payment systems) I have voiced my displeasure.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2016 19:26:27 GMT
If they bring any ticket offices back they won't staff with the SAMFs that used to work them, they will be run by CSAs on a rota basis who know far, far less than the old ticket office staff and who won't learn quickly as they won't work them permanently.
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Post by crusty54 on Oct 9, 2016 19:38:45 GMT
The ticket office suite in the Northern Line ticket hall at Charing Cross is currently disappearing.
Shops coming soon.
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 9, 2016 20:17:52 GMT
If they bring any ticket offices back they won't staff with the SAMFs that used to work them, they will be run by CSAs on a rota basis who know far, far less than the old ticket office staff and who won't learn quickly as they won't work them permanently. Bit of an overgeneralisation there. A lot of CSAs know at least as much as a former SAMF, indeed some know a lot more. Moot point though. The likelihood of any offices reopening is small. The likelihood of them being operated by LUL staff in the way they used to be is smaller still. Expect more Visitor Centres if anything.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2016 10:20:13 GMT
If they bring any ticket offices back they won't staff with the SAMFs that used to work them, they will be run by CSAs on a rota basis who know far, far less than the old ticket office staff and who won't learn quickly as they won't work them permanently. Bit of an overgeneralisation there. A lot of CSAs know at least as much as a former SAMF, indeed some know a lot more. Moot point though. The likelihood of any offices reopening is small. The likelihood of them being operated by LUL staff in the way they used to be is smaller still. Expect more Visitor Centres if anything. Just to explain, was thinking of process rather than knowledge of tickets.
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Post by snoggle on Feb 23, 2017 15:53:16 GMT
LU has published a paper about the next steps to implement the recommendations from the Mayoral / LTW review of the ticket office closure plan. content.tfl.gov.uk/csopp-20170302-part-1-item10-london-underground-station-action-plan.pdfConfirms 325 extra staff to be recruited. They are to be mainly deployed in outer area / quieter stations. There also seem to be a number of other tweaks and adjustments to publicity, signage, staff deployment, technology etc. There is also reference to the upcoming Oyster App - apparently in customer trials now. This will allow people to check card balances, top up / buy season tickets on the go and then collect them 30 minutes later as they use a gateline. Other features will be added later in the year. I knew the app was imminent but not that it had go into a customer trial stage.
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Post by mattdickinson on Feb 23, 2017 19:53:24 GMT
LU has published a paper about the next steps to implement the recommendations from the Mayoral / LTW review of the ticket office closure plan. content.tfl.gov.uk/csopp-20170302-part-1-item10-london-underground-station-action-plan.pdfConfirms 325 extra staff to be recruited. They are to be mainly deployed in outer area / quieter stations. There also seem to be a number of other tweaks and adjustments to publicity, signage, staff deployment, technology etc. There is also reference to the upcoming Oyster App - apparently in customer trials now. This will allow people to check card balances, top up / buy season tickets on the go and then collect them 30 minutes later as they use a gateline. Other features will be added later in the year. I knew the app was imminent but not that it had go into a customer trial stage. Pick up on buses should also be possible. Details are at: What Do They Know
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Post by aslefshrugged on Feb 24, 2017 7:29:25 GMT
"As a result, we have committed to recruit 325 additional roles to our stations. At least 200 of these will be full-time roles and they will include more than 100 supervisor positions"
The idea of recruiting Supervisors from outside seems bizarre, back when I was on stations you had to do at least 6 months as a Station Assistant before you could apply for Supervisor or anything else, the thought of someone with no railway experience being left in charge of a station doesn't fill me with confidence.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 8:16:16 GMT
"As a result, we have committed to recruit 325 additional roles to our stations. At least 200 of these will be full-time roles and they will include more than 100 supervisor positions" The idea of recruiting Supervisors from outside seems bizarre, back when I was on stations you had to do at least 6 months as a Station Assistant before you could apply for Supervisor or anything else, the thought of someone with no railway experience being left in charge of a station doesn't fill me with confidence. My understanding is that the supervisor roles will be filled with people on a lengthy waiting list from the promotional campaign last year (and the people who are working below their substantial grade or overestablished). I think (hope) this is just poor wording in the document. There are 4 people waiting for css1 positions on my group from last years recruitment and 2 who are old world supervisors waiting to be sent to a css1 substantive role. Saying that I have met a few direct recruit supervisors so it must have been done at some point in the past.
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Post by Tubeboy on Feb 24, 2017 11:28:57 GMT
Yes, that's correct. Supervisor positions will be filled internally. There are a lot of CSA's currently waiting for training, having been successful in applying. Lots of rumours going around as to changes post April. But ill hold fire, as they are just rumours.
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Post by rheostar on Mar 5, 2017 16:00:54 GMT
Saying that I have met a few direct recruit supervisors so it must have been done at some point in the past. When I joined LU in 1979 I was offered direct recruit Supervisor, but I chose to come on as a guard.
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Post by revupminster on Mar 5, 2017 18:55:13 GMT
Saying that I have met a few direct recruit supervisors so it must have been done at some point in the past. When I joined LU in 1979 I was offered direct recruit Supervisor, but I chose to come on as a guard. 1979 was pre company plan (1991) so I presume it was for Station Foreman which were directly recruited as well as promotions from railman and leading railman (the successors to stationman and ticket collector) Station Inspectors were internal promotions from Foreman and Train Driver until one man trains practically killed that route due to pay differences.
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DWS
every second count's
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Post by DWS on Mar 5, 2017 19:07:06 GMT
When I joined LU in 1979 I was offered direct recruit Supervisor, but I chose to come on as a guard. 1979 was pre company plan (1991) so I presume it was for Station Foreman which were directly recruited as well as promotions from railman and leading railman (the successors to stationman and ticket collector) Station Inspectors were internal promotions from Foreman and Train Driver until one man trains practically killed that route due to pay differences. Not all Station Inspectors came from Foreman or Train Drivers. In 1972 I was promoted from Relief Signalman to Station Inspector "A".
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Post by revupminster on Mar 5, 2017 19:51:05 GMT
1979 was pre company plan (1991) so I presume it was for Station Foreman which were directly recruited as well as promotions from railman and leading railman (the successors to stationman and ticket collector) Station Inspectors were internal promotions from Foreman and Train Driver until one man trains practically killed that route due to pay differences. Not all Station Inspectors came from Foreman or Train Drivers. In 1972 I was promoted from Relief Signalman to Station Inspector "A". True. I always forget about signalmen. Out of sight, out of mind. Although as a Relief Booking Clerk I did three weeks at Whitechapel (1975) cabin to qualify as emergency cover.
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