Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2016 9:57:47 GMT
Could a driver on a 38 stock technically control the doors on the train - i.e., open and close them at stations? Or were the closing-door buttons only located at the back of the train and controlled by what I assume was called the door guard?
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Apr 9, 2016 10:03:02 GMT
On recent runs of the 38ts a Guard was rostered, so it would seem that there is no OPO facility. Edit to add: here we see the Guard "in action" Guard Only by Paul Knapton, on Flickr
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2016 10:23:42 GMT
Tanks for your quick reply. What's OPO capacity?
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Post by superteacher on Apr 9, 2016 10:30:12 GMT
Tanks for your quick reply. What's OPO capacity? OPO stands for one person operation. The 38 stock definitely had no door open and close buttons in the cab. Trains did have an end door cut out button which was used when the front or rear doors were in the tunnel. I'm not sure if the cab had one of these, or just the guard's position.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2016 10:39:56 GMT
There was a door cut out button in the cab, for 'short' platforms - e.g. London Bridge NB Northern was one in 1938 days - there were several others. I think a 7-car reversing north to south at Euston (City) in years gone by also had to draw forward with the front pair of (arriving) doors 'cut out.
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Post by Colin D on Apr 9, 2016 10:40:48 GMT
The end door cut out button at the Gaurds position controlled the rear doors and the Motorman could cut out the first set of doors using the button in the cab.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Apr 9, 2016 10:43:13 GMT
The conventional position for the guard on the Combine was in the passenger saloon at the inner (non-driving) end of the last car (an exception had to be made during the nine-car experiment, where the guard rode in the seventh car as the last two cars were not always on the platform). www.trainweb.org/tubeprune/72%20TS%20Guard%20position%2072131.jpg After the formation of London Transport, this practice continued (although, exceptionally, O stock was built with guards' controls in the cabs in accordance with former Metropolitan Railway practice). With a view to eventual conversion to one-person operation (OPO), the guards' controls were installed in the cabs of new trains from C stock and 1973 stock onwards, the guard riding in the rear cab. (This required 1973 stock and D stock to be slightly shorter than their 1959/R stock predecessors, to ensure the rear of the train would not project beyond the ends of the shortest platforms they served) 1967 automatic stock never had guards*, or cab doors (apparently as a precaution against drivers operating the start signal whilst standing on the platform) and as 1972 stock was built to the same design, the guard wouldn't have been able to work from the cab. The conversion of A stock and 1972 mark 2 stock to OPO required moving the door controls into the cabs, but this was never done for older tube stocks, which continued with guards until the end in 1999 www.squarewheels.org.uk/rly/stock/1959tubeStock/*arguably they had guards but no drivers, as in normal operation the trains drove themselves, the human operator only having to control the doors and give the starting signal.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2016 11:01:06 GMT
So a driver of 38 stock had no way to open and close the doors? I assume he could lock the door to the cab? (I'm writing a novel, not planning an wayward tube maneuvers!)
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Post by superteacher on Apr 9, 2016 11:09:25 GMT
Guards in fact lasted into the first few weeks of 2000.
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Apr 9, 2016 11:29:31 GMT
So a driver of 38 stock had no way to open and close the doors? I assume he could lock the door to the cab? (I'm writing a novel, not planning an wayward tube maneuvers!) The driver (Motorman) of a 38ts did just that, drive. The passengers were the complete responsibility of the Guard. As now, the door into the cab from the saloon (called the J door) is always locked.
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Post by crusty54 on Apr 9, 2016 12:43:33 GMT
before you ask the doors on the cars are lettered from A onwards to identify their position.
There are letters on the doors.
The cab door is position J.
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Apr 10, 2016 21:38:36 GMT
I think there was a story from Q8 many years back in the forums infancy that elicited a reply indicating that, through some set of circumstances, naughty train crews many decades ago on the eastern district might let their guards go home early, and run motorman-only for the last few stations, with the MM at each stop going to and opening up the front guards panel and doing the doors from there. A similar method would theoretically be possible with any similar crewed stock, though completely against rules, exceptionally unlikely, and never recorded! Probably best just to assume it never happened!!
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