metman
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5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
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Post by metman on Oct 9, 2015 17:27:37 GMT
A treat on your travels home - you will see the east end RAT in the Klondike sidings at Neasden! Here for the lath one wonders?
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 9, 2015 18:27:14 GMT
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Post by spsmiler on Oct 9, 2015 21:30:57 GMT
Just as well therefore that I had not tried to see it in action today... as rules here prohibit this I wont either share the timetable not say how I obtained it.
Simon
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 9, 2015 21:33:32 GMT
Bare in mind that both Central line RATs 'run as required', so there's no guarantees of seeing it even if it had been there - the Met RAT is more reliable in that respect.
That said, the 5-car west end unit has transferred to Hainault to cover for the 8-car, so there will still be some RAT action, although likely more varied due to the need to cover both ends with the one unit.
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metman
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5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
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Post by metman on Oct 9, 2015 22:56:24 GMT
She's been moved now but it's great to see a 'proper train' at Neasden!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2015 9:05:50 GMT
Has the 5 car West end unit gone back to Ruislip yet? I have failed a number of times in previous years to see it, so might as well add a couple more to that list this autumn!
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 16, 2015 15:55:58 GMT
No, the 5-car remains at Hainault, and this will remain the case until work is completed on the 8-car, according to my generally-reliable sources. At that point it will transfer back west.
The 8-car has now moved onto the lathe at Neasden, so it probably won't be too long before it's out and about again. If anyone wants photos of the 5-car at the east-end, try and do so quickly!
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Post by roboverground on Oct 17, 2015 12:41:51 GMT
stock numbers 1406-2682-9125-1681 1682-9577-2406-1407 (8 car) with 9125 of '59 stock - 1570-9691-2440-9441-1441 (5 car)
I think are current formations for this season if anyone can confirm
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2015 15:37:02 GMT
Correct I believe, with 2406 being the 'new' Sandite car.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2015 10:57:42 GMT
Thanks for the confirmation.
When i saw the East End 8 car in 2010 it was formed 1406-2406-9125-1681-1682-2682-9459-1407, so is 9577 a permanent replacement for 9459 or are they interchangeable?
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Post by philthetube on Oct 21, 2015 12:43:17 GMT
Some with northern line interior maps and some with certral, don't know numbers.
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 21, 2015 13:49:25 GMT
Permanent replacement, although the formation of the east end unit has been 'fluid' for the last few years with trailer cars being swapped out for motored vehicles.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Oct 21, 2015 13:58:29 GMT
Thanks for the confirmation. When i saw the East End 8 car in 2010 it was formed 1406-2406-9125-1681-1682-2682-9459-1407, so is 9577 a permanent replacement for 9459 or are they interchangeable? One might expect a mixture of line diagrams as the train is a mixture of stocks - they are all 1962-stock cars except 9125. Some 1962 stock did run on the Northern towards the end but I don't think any 1959 stock ran on the Central after the 1962 stock was delivered in - errm - c1962.
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Post by miff on Oct 23, 2015 18:16:48 GMT
1962 stock trains always included a number of '59 stock trailers ordered as a stop-gap so that 8-car '59 stock formations could run on the central line before the 1962 stock arrived. When these trains moved on they left the extra cars for the 62 fleet.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Oct 23, 2015 20:44:21 GMT
1962 stock trains always included a number of '59 stock trailers ordered as a stop-gap so that 8-car '59 stock formations could run on the central line before the 1962 stock arrived. . I thought it was the other way round - the NDMs which were built to augment 1959 stock were 1962 stock. As you say, when the rest of the 1962 stock was deleivered the 1959 stock moved on, leaving the extra cars to form part of the 62 fleet.
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metman
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5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
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Post by metman on Oct 24, 2015 11:09:58 GMT
The 1959 cars were NDM ordered to boost the trains diverted from the Piccadilly line. When the 1962 stock began to arrive the 1959 stock moved to the Piccadilly leaving the spare NDM to be added to the 1962 trains. Therefore it is my understanding that some of the 8 car trains of 1962 stock had an older 1959 NDM in.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Oct 24, 2015 11:23:10 GMT
Are we just arguing about semantics here or is there a physical difference between 1959 NDM cars and 1962 ones? (I know there were slight differences in the cabs of the DMs, but NDMs don't have cabs!) As I understand it the extra cars were always numbered as 1962 stock even though they started their careers formed in 1959 stock trains on the Central Line
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2015 16:22:00 GMT
There is just a small subtle external difference between the 1959 and 1962 Tube Stock NDMs at the trailing ends and the trailing ends of DMs (between the single door and the car corner). On the 1962 Stock, there is a waist level join line, immediately under which was the car number. On the 1959s the body was 'smooth' at this point. The 1962 trailers also had no join line at this position. It was the answer to this question that got me accepted for employment with LT in July 1965. The interviewing panel asked me what (else) was 'different' between the 1959s and 1962s (other than the cab) and they purported they didn't realise the visible difference (although I was convinced they did!). If you look across the trailing ends of 1962 stock, there was a slight difference in the join lines there as well. (takes 'anorak' off ).
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Post by Chris W on Oct 24, 2015 20:51:06 GMT
Thanks Reg... If you require a name change, just let us know
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Post by norbitonflyer on Oct 24, 2015 21:33:13 GMT
So did the "extra" NDMs have this join line?
If Wikipedia is correct, Metrocammell built all the 1959/62 stock except the 1962 stock trailers which were built by BR Derby, which may explain why the 1962 trailers were of different construction to the DMs and NDMs, but takes us no further in distinguishing the three groups of NDM - those which were always in 1959 stock, those which were always in 1962 stock, and those which were delivered in trains of 1959 stock but later transferred to trains of 1962 stock.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2015 9:12:49 GMT
So did the "extra" NDMs have this join line? If Wikipedia is correct, Metrocammell built all the 1959/62 stock except the 1962 stock trailers which were built by BR Derby, which may explain why the 1962 trailers were of different construction to the DMs and NDMs, but takes us no further in distinguishing the three groups of NDM - those which were always in 1959 stock, those which were always in 1962 stock, and those which were delivered in trains of 1959 stock but later transferred to trains of 1962 stock. The 57 NDMs that went with the 1962 Stock were identical to the 1959s - no car corner join line. It was only the true 1962 NDMs (and DMs) that had the join line.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Oct 25, 2015 9:37:06 GMT
I stand corrected then - physically they were 1959-type, even if they were numbered ab initio in the 1962 stock series.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2015 10:07:43 GMT
Correct.
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 29, 2015 16:18:28 GMT
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Post by domh245 on Oct 29, 2015 16:30:36 GMT
Has it been to a mod-shop to have xenon lights fitted and suspension lowered? Seriously though, what is with the blue-tinged lamps? Is that what they had left in stock, or is there some operational rationale behind it?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2015 17:04:04 GMT
Now that is a sight for sore eyes!
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on Oct 29, 2015 17:15:49 GMT
Now that is a sight for sore eyes! All those trains would have looked much better in that shade of red all over whilst in service IMHO!
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 29, 2015 17:15:55 GMT
Has it been to a mod-shop to have xenon lights fitted and suspension lowered? Seriously though, what is with the blue-tinged lamps? Is that what they had left in stock, or is there some operational rationale behind it? One end only (1407) has been fitted with LED headlamps, thus the blue tinge. There is, apparently, a reason for it - I just don't know what it is (yet)!
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Post by MoreToJack on Oct 29, 2015 18:16:15 GMT
For the record, the 5-car, west-end RAT has also returned to Ruislip, leaving immediately after the arrival of the 8-car and running as T600. Sadly I wasn't quick enough to get a photo, and ended up one train behind of it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2015 14:52:10 GMT
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