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Post by Red Dragon on Oct 7, 2015 18:58:19 GMT
Am I correct in assuming that the "Stops Here" on the boards at Earl's Court mean "Terminates Here"?
Also, the picture (below) shows that platform 3 doesn't have this board. Do all the platforms have them?
Edit: picture doesn't work, link here.
© Copyright Keith Edkins and licensed for reuse under this Creative Commons Licence.
RedDragon
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Post by superteacher on Oct 7, 2015 19:24:55 GMT
Am I correct in assuming that the "Stops Here" on the boards at Earl's Court mean "Terminates Here"?
Also, the picture (below) shows that platform 3 doesn't have this board. Do all the platforms have them?
Edit: picture doesn't work, link here.
© Copyright Keith Edkins and licensed for reuse under this Creative Commons Licence.
RedDragon You are correct in that it means "terminates here." Not sure if all platforms have them. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2015 19:45:40 GMT
Judging by this image, it's been added to the describer on platform 3. It's worth noting that platform 4 is the only platform at which trains can't terminate, unless they're being withdrawn from service and run empty to another location to reverse or be put away (a move which could be done in passenger service). At platforms 1 & 2, it's possible to terminate and then head into the triangle sidings. Also, at platform 2, trains may reverse east to west via a mainline shunt into platform 3. At platform 3 it's possible to reverse west to east, although this move can be done in passenger service and, therefore, it is not necessary to tip the train out. My point being, at platforms 1 & 2, it's possible for a train to arrive in service and then terminate and go out of passenger service and reverse or be put away (making a 'stops here' indication very useful). At platform 3 it is possible to terminate, although the train may arrive and depart in service, which is a slightly different matter. At platform 4, the train may, of course, be withdrawn from service, but it would then have to proceed empty to another location (such as Olympia, or Parsons Green, say) to be put away, or reversed. The journey to these locations could be done in passenger service, meaning that Earl's Court is not the ultimate destination in this case, merely the station where the train was withdrawn from service. Whereas, in the case of trains terminating at platforms 1, 2 & 3, Earl's Court is the final destination. If that makes sense? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2015 2:49:00 GMT
Judging by this image, it's been added to the describer on platform 3. It's worth noting that platform 4 is the only platform at which trains can't terminate, unless they're being withdrawn from service and run empty to another location to reverse or be put away (a move which could be done in passenger service). At platforms 1 & 2, it's possible to terminate and then head into the triangle sidings. Also, at platform 2, trains may reverse east to west via a mainline shunt into platform 3. At platform 3 it's possible to reverse west to east, although this move can be done in passenger service and, therefore, it is not necessary to tip the train out. My point being, at platforms 1 & 2, it's possible for a train to arrive in service and then terminate and go out of passenger service and reverse or be put away (making a 'stops here' indication very useful). At platform 3 it is possible to terminate, although the train may arrive and depart in service, which is a slightly different matter. At platform 4, the train may, of course, be withdrawn from service, but it would then have to proceed empty to another location (such as Olympia, or Parsons Green, say) to be put away, or reversed. The journey to these locations could be done in passenger service, meaning that Earl's Court is not the ultimate destination in this case, merely the station where the train was withdrawn from service. Whereas, in the case of trains terminating at platforms 1, 2 & 3, Earl's Court is the final destination. If that makes sense? In the previous timetable a couple of trains came from Edgware Road and detrained in Earls Court Plat 4 and ran empty direct to to Lillie Bridge Depot and you don't have to go all the way to Olympia to do the move , I'm unsure if it still happens in the current one without looking. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2015 2:51:25 GMT
Judging by this image, it's been added to the describer on platform 3. It's worth noting that platform 4 is the only platform at which trains can't terminate, unless they're being withdrawn from service and run empty to another location to reverse or be put away (a move which could be done in passenger service). At platforms 1 & 2, it's possible to terminate and then head into the triangle sidings. Also, at platform 2, trains may reverse east to west via a mainline shunt into platform 3. At platform 3 it's possible to reverse west to east, although this move can be done in passenger service and, therefore, it is not necessary to tip the train out. My point being, at platforms 1 & 2, it's possible for a train to arrive in service and then terminate and go out of passenger service and reverse or be put away (making a 'stops here' indication very useful). At platform 3 it is possible to terminate, although the train may arrive and depart in service, which is a slightly different matter. At platform 4, the train may, of course, be withdrawn from service, but it would then have to proceed empty to another location (such as Olympia, or Parsons Green, say) to be put away, or reversed. The journey to these locations could be done in passenger service, meaning that Earl's Court is not the ultimate destination in this case, merely the station where the train was withdrawn from service. Whereas, in the case of trains terminating at platforms 1, 2 & 3, Earl's Court is the final destination. If that makes sense? In the previous timetable a couple of trains came from Edgware Road and detrained in Earls Court Plat 4 and ran empty direct to to Lillie Bridge Depot, I'm unsure if it still happens in the current one without looking. I did look and couldn't see any, but I may have overlooked them. I think they're all empty from HSK. In any case, would they not have to run into Olympia beforehand, or can the move be done without actually entering the station itself? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2015 2:54:12 GMT
tut, You got in before I edited my post. You don't have to go all the way to Olympia to get into Lillie Bridge and can stop short of the platform and change ends on the line.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2015 2:57:30 GMT
tut, You got in before I edited my post. You don't have to go all the way to Olympia to get into Lillie Bridge and can stop short of the platform and change ends on the line. Just happened to check the forum at the time  Fair enough! I've learned something new In that case - disregard my essay - all platforms at Earl's Court can be the final destination of trains. Which (wresting the thread back on topic from mine own self) would seem to make the provision of a "stops here" indication useful on any and all platforms. |
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Post by Dstock7080 on Oct 8, 2015 5:51:20 GMT
Also, the picture (below) shows that platform 3 doesn't have this board. Do all the platforms have them? All platforms at Earl's Court District now have 'STOPS HERE' The ones on pfm.3-4 were provided fairly recently, as has been said for the terminating trains running empty to Olympia, expecially when the S Stock were providing the 'preview service'. |
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Post by wimblephil on Oct 8, 2015 6:53:13 GMT
Surely the term 'STOPS HERE' is not as as good as 'TERMINATES' would be? Given trains are generally described as 'fast' of 'stopping', all trains 'stop' at Earl's Court!
I highly doubt many are confused by it though! Semantics I guess..!?
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Post by uzairjubilee on Oct 8, 2015 9:02:41 GMT
Also, the picture (below) shows that platform 3 doesn't have this board. Do all the platforms have them? All platforms at Earl's Court District now have 'STOPS HERE' The ones on pfm.3-4 were provided fairly recently, as has been said for the terminating trains running empty to Olympia, expecially when the S Stock were providing the 'preview service'. Beat me to it  |
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on Oct 8, 2015 9:22:37 GMT
Surely the term 'STOPS HERE' is not as as good as 'TERMINATES' would be? Given trains are generally described as 'fast' of 'stopping', all trains 'stop' at Earl's Court! I highly doubt many are confused by it though! Semantics I guess..!? I'm not usually concerned about stuff like the above but in this case I think you're absolutely right. All trains "stop here" at Earls Court so the indicator is a misnomer. It should indeed be "Terminates". Anybody got a ladder and some Tippex? |
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Post by Dstock7080 on Oct 8, 2015 9:42:10 GMT
I would guess the phrase 'terminates here' was not in the general language when these boards were installed by the District Railway in 1908/10.
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Oct 8, 2015 9:46:08 GMT
I would guess the phrase 'terminates here' was not in the general language when these boards were installed by the District Railway in 1908/10. Presumably the Train would have called at intermediate stations and stopped at the terminus. Though called at seems too modern somehow. |
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Post by theblackferret on Oct 8, 2015 14:47:38 GMT
I would guess the phrase 'terminates here' was not in the general language when these boards were installed by the District Railway in 1908/10. Presumably the Train would have called at intermediate stations and stopped at the terminus. Though called at seems too modern somehow. Actually, it is more of a 1920's/30's phrase. After all, people were still leaving their calling cards in polite circles in those days, so it fits well. And I might add, off-topic, on the Picc. at that time, the guards would call out 'Passing Brompton Road', 'Passing Down Street' for trains omitting those stations & the former call became the title of a West End farce that ran for over 150 performances & had nothing to do with the Tube!! Back on subject, it has to be terminates here, otherwise it makes no sense to Tube oppos, station staff or the public. The only pedantry I'd add is whether a train indicator should merely indicate, as if it's taking an informed or uninformed stab at things, or whether it should actually state the bald facts of where the train now arriving is or isn't heading for. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2015 14:59:49 GMT
Is it not implicit in the fact that the indicator has lit up at all, that the train is calling/stopping at Earl's Court?
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Post by John Tuthill on Oct 8, 2015 15:27:27 GMT
Surely the term 'STOPS HERE' is not as as good as 'TERMINATES' would be? Given trains are generally described as 'fast' of 'stopping', all trains 'stop' at Earl's Court! I highly doubt many are confused by it though! Semantics I guess..!? Surely 'STOPS HERE' implies exactly that, as opposed to a 'NOT STOPPING HERE' would imply a thru' train? I'm sure in the vague distance of my youth I'm sure when Northern Line trains were turned at Archway, the indicator stated 'TERMINATES HERE' What did the indicator used to display at Kennington on the old displays, before they ran around the loop? |
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Post by North End on Oct 8, 2015 23:44:43 GMT
I would guess the phrase 'terminates here' was not in the general language when these boards were installed by the District Railway in 1908/10. I think that term was still being used much more recently than that. I'm pretty sure (but not 100% certain) the now-removed illuminating indicator at Acton Town WB Picc had a 'STOPS HERE' indication, that sign also included Heathrow so can't be earlier than 1970s. Must say I much prefer the old indicators to dot-matrix. When properly maintained they were much easier to read from a distance. Only a small handful left on the system nowadays, sadly, and none at all on many lines. Some did survive until surprisingly recently, for example at Heathrow and Brixton. As for the term 'stops here', if you think of it as the *service* stopping rather than the train, it's not so incorrect, although I agree terminates is probably better. Having said that, the word defective is allegedly sufficiently unknown to enough people that LU made a policy of not using that word, one wonders if the word terminates is also beyond some people. Certainly I've had a few blank faces when attempting to tip out and have had to resort to basic language "you have to get off". |
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Post by abe on Oct 11, 2015 15:14:09 GMT
'STOPS HERE' is used in the lightbox indicators at Harrow-on-the-Hill.
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castlebar
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Post by castlebar on Oct 12, 2015 20:10:29 GMT
Three blanks there. > Two were 'Northfields' and 'Hounslow West'
'South Harrow' was still on the boards at Acton Town until the early 1960s but not at Earls Court > 'Stops here' was far more likely
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Post by wimblephil on Oct 20, 2015 17:53:47 GMT
Just looking up and the indicators now... is there any logical reason for the order in which the destinations appear? Or is it just so? Seems kind of random!
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Post by Dstock7080 on Oct 20, 2015 19:32:27 GMT
They are very random!
Some have changed position over the years, final destinations altered; Charing Cross; Bow Road etc. Non-stopping (WB) plates removed.
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Post by Chris M on Oct 20, 2015 19:59:36 GMT
I expect that there was logic initially, at least from the signalling side, but over time codes have been reallocated so that original logic has been lost.
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