Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 14:44:58 GMT
Has there ever been any passenger trains that have used the loop that allows a Northbound Piccadilly line to run to either the Northbound or Southbound (using the 'Euston loop') Northern line (City)at Euston ?
Also is the loop reversible- e.g could a Northbound Northern line use the Kings Cross loop to head North on the Piccadilly line?
Does anyone have any links to a clear diagram?
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Post by domh245 on Mar 31, 2014 14:54:30 GMT
Try looking at carto metro London (Google it) which will hive you a god idea of the layout of the loop. It doesn't show you things like signals or speed limits, but it should give you a good idea of the layout of the lines
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Post by roboverground on Mar 31, 2014 15:51:26 GMT
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Post by MoreToJack on Mar 31, 2014 17:50:53 GMT
Not sure if it's been used in service, but the LTM's 1938 stock used it last year during the tours on the Northern and Piccadilly lines - after running two round trips on the Charing Cross branch it then went down the Bank branch, used the loop and headed north to Cockfosters for the tour back to Acton Town.
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Post by trt on Mar 31, 2014 20:27:35 GMT
Is that loop cleared for carrying passengers?
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Post by superteacher on Mar 31, 2014 22:02:01 GMT
Is that loop cleared for carrying passengers? According to the track and signal diagrams, it seems that you need to pass a shunt signal to enter it from either end, which implies that it is not cleared for passenger moves. To be fair, it doesn't really need to be. Wouldn't mind a trip over it though! |
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Post by trt on Apr 1, 2014 8:48:03 GMT
Is that loop cleared for carrying passengers? According to the track and signal diagrams, it seems that you need to pass a shunt signal to enter it from either end, which implies that it is not cleared for passenger moves. To be fair, it doesn't really need to be. Wouldn't mind a trip over it though! My thoughts exactly! |
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Post by bassmike on Apr 1, 2014 10:15:50 GMT
USED THE LOOP AT LEAST THREE TIMES ON RAILTOURS.
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Post by railtechnician on Apr 1, 2014 16:28:09 GMT
USED THE LOOP AT LEAST THREE TIMES ON RAILTOURS. Perhaps but like most tube tunnels you haven't really seen it until you've walked it! I walked it many times when doing maintenance. |
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Post by superteacher on Apr 1, 2014 17:50:53 GMT
What is the gradient like? The Northern is a bit deeper than the Piccadilly at Kings Cross.
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Post by motorman on Apr 1, 2014 21:16:06 GMT
I recall travelling on it on a 38 Stock railtour transferring from the Picc to Northern Line. The exact itinerary escapes my memory now but it could have been the farewell tour onto the Northern Line using one of the Bakerloo Line EHO units. That of course would pre date the four 38 Stock units which went back to operate on the Northern.
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Post by 1018509 on Apr 1, 2014 23:16:56 GMT
In the early 70's I was a Train Technician 1 (then called a Call Point Examiner) at Leicester Square nights. I was called to an engineering train with a defective deadman spring which is easy enough to change but meant that I got to travel with the train round the loop to Highgate Wood sidings as it was then.
In the early morning I travelled back with the train and left it at Leicester Square as it was stabling at Lillie Bridge.
Interesting job that as we didn't carry battery loco spares but swapped the entire deadman handle over with one from an unused cab. As this train was not going to uncouple there was two spare cabs I could use.
I could have got the line controller to get me a cab back to Leicester Square but it was a Summer night and I wanted to ride the loop in the other direction. I see on Google Maps there are sheds there. I can't recall these; are they new since the early 70's? |
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roythebus
Pleased to say the restoration of BEA coach MLL738 is as complete as it can be, now restoring MLL721
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Post by roythebus on Apr 2, 2014 7:41:09 GMT
Passenger trains can pass shunt signals with passengers on providing any point traversed are fitted with point locks or the points are clipped and scotched. The signalman's permission will also be required for the move. Special train will have these instruction printed in the Traffic Circular or whatever the modern equivalent is on LUL.
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Post by railtechnician on Apr 2, 2014 15:31:25 GMT
What is the gradient like? The Northern is a bit deeper than the Piccadilly at Kings Cross. Hardly noticeable at all, the tunnel runs to just outside Euston and I have no idea what the relative level of the Northern line is with respect the Picc at that point. The last time I walked the loop circa 2004 there remained a concrete trackbed without ballast. Gradients are less noticeable when walking in such areas but it is definitely gently downhill to the Picc/Northern boundary marker not far from the Northern running tunnels. The gradient stands out more when looking back towards the Picc around the curve. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2014 1:00:03 GMT
USED THE LOOP AT LEAST THREE TIMES ON RAILTOURS. If you hear of a railtour that will use this loop, please let me know! |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2014 9:08:26 GMT
I don't think it would be likely to happen, but it would be great to do a tour that took in the King's Cross loop. I've done the Euston loop during engineering closure, but the King's Cross loop is top of my track bashing list for sure!
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North End
Beneath Newington Causeway
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Post by North End on Apr 22, 2014 13:06:32 GMT
I don't think it would be likely to happen, but it would be great to do a tour that took in the King's Cross loop. I've done the Euston loop during engineering closure, but the King's Cross loop is top of my track bashing list for sure! Now the Northern Line has gone over to the awful Seltrac signalling, the chances of any tour visiting the Northern Line again are remote, at least for the forseeable future. Apart from 95 stock, the only trains able to work on the Northern Line now are selected engineers trains, and the restrictions associated with operating these are such that they can only really be operated during engineering hours. There would be a significant number of technical and cost challenges to be overcome before something like the 38 stock could again operate on the Northern Line. Never say never, but as things stand at present it's unlikely. Even operating during engineering hours under a possession would be so difficult as to be a virtual non-starter. As far as I can recall, the last tour to use the KX Loop with passengers was one of the Cravens tours in the late 1990s. The 38 stock has returned off the line empty on the recent visits, though a few staff were able to ride through. In all honesty the KX Loop is not that exciting, apart from that the track is ancient, it looks and feels no different to any other tunnel. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2014 12:59:02 GMT
In all honesty the KX Loop is not that exciting, apart from that the track is ancient, it looks and feels no different to any other tunnel. Quite so, but it's still required track for me! |
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Post by bassmike on Apr 28, 2014 12:51:09 GMT
I wonder if LT have ever considered running railtours overnight like R.A.T.P do in Paris? That way they could possibly overcome the problems of running on lines with different control systems as the train could run under engineering conditions with extra pilotpersons etc: as required.
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Post by domh245 on Apr 28, 2014 17:40:44 GMT
That's difficult because only the most die hard enthusiasts will be up at midnight to go on a train through a network of tunnels, and whilst there aren't any big works overnight, there are still various things going on which would have to be postponed.
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Post by bassmike on Apr 28, 2014 18:15:52 GMT
Well--- they managed it on the paris metro ok -- very well patronised . The participants from here were advised by John Thomason and there were several tours over the last few years. Also I would think that most participants are "die-hard" enthusiasts. There have been a few tours lately and it even involved running steel-wheel stock over pneumatic lines which is more involved than anything they have to do here . There were "various things" going on there too.I'm often up at midnight without neccessarily going on a railtour!.
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