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Post by Deep Level on Jul 5, 2010 3:23:17 GMT
I have heard and read a lot of talk about Electrifying the GOBLIN line. But as most of you may know, this will probably not happen any time soon.
But what is to stop Class 172's going from Barking - Richmind/ Clapham Junction (Apart from making change to Gospal Oak)?
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Post by astock5000 on Jul 5, 2010 8:44:38 GMT
There are a lot of freight trains that use the line from Gospel Oak to Willesden, so there might not be enough capacity for another 4 tph service without reducing the frequency of the NLL service.
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Post by harlesden on Jul 5, 2010 9:05:05 GMT
A 172 service to Richmond in the current 2-car formation would get packed at Willesden Junction, while the 378 behind would wonder where all the passengers were and proceed to Richmond half-empty
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Post by Deep Level on Jul 5, 2010 12:09:29 GMT
I didn't mean all trains to go to Richmond/ Clapham Junction. Maybe 1tph off-peak and 2tph peak. Just a suggestion.
Or they could possibly go to Wilesden Junction if they bring back Platform two (Low Level Bay Platform).
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Post by andypurk on Jul 5, 2010 13:34:21 GMT
I have heard and read a lot of talk about Electrifying the GOBLIN line. But as most of you may know, this will probably not happen any time soon. But what is to stop Class 172's going from Barking - Richmind/ Clapham Junction (Apart from making change to Gospal Oak)? There will be insufficient class 172 units to run both the planned 15 min frequency on Gospel Oak - Barking and to run through to the western end of the North London line. The trains will also be shorter, potentially causing loading delays and overcrowding. |
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Post by andypurk on Jul 5, 2010 13:37:52 GMT
There are a lot of freight trains that use the line from Gospel Oak to Willesden, so there might not be enough capacity for another 4 tph service without reducing the frequency of the NLL service. Much of the freight is only still going this way because the freight loops between Camden Road and Highbury & Islington, on the North London Line, have not yet been commissioned. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 20:15:37 GMT
There will be NO services using Class 172 units beyond Gospel Oak. This was looked at during the Cross London RUS and quite rightly ruled out of the question. There will be a through service one day but only when GOB has been wired and new platforms built at Gospel Oak, so in the current climate probably not before 2015 or 16. That is our planning assumption in TfL London Rail.
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Post by Geoffram on Jul 5, 2010 20:44:23 GMT
I always rue the day in 1981 that the Goblin service was diverted away from Kentish Town, where one could interchange with trains to the City, the West End, and now right through to South London.I know the reason for this was the electrification of the then nascent Thameslink service, but the curve at Kentish Town hasn't exactly been built over...Gospel Oak seems such an odd place to take everybody to. I should know, I used to live there. A case of operational neatness rather than passenger demand. Yes, there would be hurdles to get ove, as I'm sure people are only too willing to point out, but just think if you lived in Walthamstow or Leyton, there would be an alternative way of getting into town.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2010 11:46:18 GMT
Or they could possibly go to Wilesden Junction if they bring back Platform two (Low Level Bay Platform). Are you talking about the one that has just been lengthened between the Watford DC line platforms? Last time I was there, it looked nearly complete. There was still a load of construction material around but that might also be for the footbridge being built to the Southbound platform. |
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Post by Deep Level on Jul 29, 2010 2:47:01 GMT
Or they could possibly go to Wilesden Junction if they bring back Platform two (Low Level Bay Platform). Are you talking about the one that has just been lengthened between the Watford DC line platforms? Last time I was there, it looked nearly complete. There was still a load of construction material around but that might also be for the footbridge being built to the Southbound platform. That's the one |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2010 16:53:05 GMT
There will be NO services using Class 172 units beyond Gospel Oak. This was looked at during the Cross London RUS and quite rightly ruled out of the question. There will be a through service one day but only when GOB has been wired and new platforms built at Gospel Oak, so in the current climate probably not before 2015 or 16. That is our planning assumption in TfL London Rail. When this happens the service I have heard will be Clapham to Grays via the GOB |
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Post by su31 on Aug 8, 2010 21:10:06 GMT
Are you talking about the one that has just been lengthened between the Watford DC line platforms? Last time I was there, it looked nearly complete. There was still a load of construction material around but that might also be for the footbridge being built to the Southbound platform. That's the one I think the bay has been extended to allow Bakerloo line trains to reverse north-south in the future? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2010 23:13:23 GMT
^^ The bay is for 4 car 378s. It is still too short for Bakerloos
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Post by harlesden on Aug 8, 2010 23:23:06 GMT
^^ The bay is for 4 car 378s. It is still too short for Bakerloos That's a relief. I always hated waiting at Willesden Junction NB only for a WJ reverser to come in. I must have made about a dozen complaints about the disparity between the NB and SB service offered to/from Harlesden/Stonebridge Park. Immense joy when Stonebridge Park reversers finally replaced the WJ reversers. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2010 12:08:28 GMT
^^ The bay is for 4 car 378s. It is still too short for Bakerloos Also too short for 2 x 2 Car Class 172's! |
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Post by glenntandh on Oct 1, 2010 3:00:42 GMT
The idea of the Barking-Clapham Junction service first emerged in the 1974 London Rail Study. It has continued in most subsequent 'Orbirail' plans and was in TfL's plan for the 'Overground' but was put onto the back burner around 2006, along with the proposed Stratford-Queens Park (Willesden Junction LL would make more sense) service.
BGOLUG do not think that the lack of T&H Line platforms at Gospel Oak is problem. Interchange with the NLL to/from Stratford could be made at Hampstead Heath. Indeed not so long ago, Gospel Oak passengers on the last train from Barking were often asked if they would be OK with being dropped off at Hampstead Heath. If so Upper Holloway signal box would be asked to tell Gospel Oak to set the road for the NLL and not the bay platform. It is possible some passengers were dropped off further west. BGOLUG has several times suggested that ECS move to Willesden TMD could be 'livened up' as it is after the last NLL has run.
The original TfL plan was for the T&H to be worked by overhauled, refurbished 3-car Class 150s, although it was never clear where the additional class 150/2 cars were going to come from. That would have made a 4TPH service with 2TPH to/from Clapham possible, although the West London Line Group were not too keen on diesels invading their all electric railway.
The MTR/laing inclusion of 8 new 2-car Class 172s in their bid for the London Rail Concession, put an end to the Clapham idea and without the need to replace the Class 150s within a few years also weakened the case for electrification in the short term.
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